Discussion:
Is Jehovah's 'wife' the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society?
(too old to reply)
Precision
2007-11-07 08:02:47 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
The circuit overseer emphasized something very important regarding the
respect we should have toward the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses. The
governing body are more than advisors. There is something far greater going
on in Brooklyn and Patterson, something on an epic and historical scale!
Those who criticize the governing body simply do not fully appreciate the
full scope and grandeur of God's WIFE and OUR MOTHER. He cited the following
article from the October 1, 1950 issue of the Watchtower magazine...


*** w50 10/1 pp. 347-348 The Way of Success ***

VISIBLE REPRESENTATIVES LIKE HER

22 In this world it is customary to speak of a high school, college or
university from which a person graduates by the heathen expression "alma
mater" (fostering mother). But the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead is not
the great mother organization of the Gilead graduates. The Watch Tower Bible
& Tract Society is not the great mother organization of Jehovah's witnesses
who have received the Kingdom truth through it and who cooperate with it
world-wide, using it as their legal and business servant and advisory
governing body. No; as Jehovah's witnesses we represent something greater
than these minor visible organizations. The great "mother" is Jehovah's
universal organization, which he created and of which he is the faithful
Husband. (Isa. 54:5; Gal. 4:26) By her he brings forth his beloved children
for his purpose. By her he gives us law and instruction, provides for us,
guides us and looks out for our welfare with a view to our everlasting life.
In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous woman so lovelily
described to King Lemuel. Just now, when God's kingdom is the paramount
issue, his "woman" is chiefly concerned with bringing forth successfully to
kingship with Jesus Christ in heaven the remnant of his royal "little flock".
Yet she is interested also in the many, many "other sheep" who will
eventually become her earthly children in God's image and likeness. Her
heart is big enough to hold a love now for them all and to gather all these
"other sheep" to her warm, loving bosom.-Luke 12:32; John 10:16.

23 However, what we see exemplified in God's woman, his heavenly universal
organization, we should look to see in his visible organization. Why?
Because his higher, greater universal organization uses it as her earthly
instrument. That is why we do see those motherly traits, those traits and
acts of a virtuous woman, in the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and in
the Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, because these profess to represent
and serve God's woman. We thank God for providing and using them. So we
stand up respectfully and bless his faithful organization, his queenly
"woman" in heaven which makes all these loving provisions for us as children
of God.-Prov. 31:28.

24 If we have an appreciation of all these truths, what shall we say is the
way of success? All the examples and the teachings of the Word of God agree
that it is the way marked by faithful, loving obedience to God and to the
commandments he issues through his Theocratic organization. Hence keep in
touch with the central organization, God's Theocratic "woman". Keep in tune
with it by accepting the Theocratic organization rules and instructions
which God issues to us through it. Never forsake these, but be teachable, as
trustful children. Hold fast to the Bible.

(End of quotation.)


How many reading this newsgroup JWs agree or disagree?

BEFORE YOU ANSWER:

Pay special attention to the first sentence of paragraph 23!

Notice the article is NOT claiming the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is
"God's woman" or wife.

Rather, the article is simply pointing out what was emphasized in the
preceding paragraph, that Jehovah's "universal organization" that is OVER
his "visible organization" is a "virtuous woman." (In the preceding
paragraph it states, "In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous
woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel.") Therefore, paragraph 23 simply
points out that if the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is Jehovah's
"visible organization" that it must exemplify God's "heavenly universal
organization" it also refers to as God's spiritual "wife"!

Further, paragraph 23 also points out that the Watchtower Bible School of
Gilead and the Watchtower Society itself both "profess to represent and
serve God's woman." We are expected to "thank God for providing and using
them" (the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and Watchtower Society) because
they claim (or "represent") to "profess and serve God's woman."

Why do we believe what they claim in this regard. We believe because as the
preceding paragraph points out, "in her we find fulfilled all the traits of
a virtuous woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel."

That may have been true in 1950.

Is it true today?

Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?

Do we thank God for providing and using them as the article says we surely
must do?

Does it ring true for us today that "her heart is big enough to hold a love
now for them all and to gather all these "other sheep" to her warm, loving
bosom"? (Luke 12:32; John 10:16.)

The governing body ARE the Watchtower Society.

They have signature authority. They control the Watchtower trust accounts
through major banking institutions. The very nature of the U.S. corporation
gives them authority over billions in real estate and assets.

Although they could have closed the Watchtower and legally retired as
billionaires due to the very nature of U.S. corporate laws for private
religious corporations, they selflessly chose to maintain and serve one of
the richest religious organizations next to the Mormon Church. To this very
day, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses have been exemplary and
honest business men, burying the proverbial "talents" safely in the soils of
the banking system, real estate and securities holdings and other
financially safe instruments. These assets are buried safely under the
powers of modern financial laws in the United States of America, the most
powerful modern "empire" in human history, a nation to pale Rome and Egypt
by comparison. The Watchtower Society's treasures on earth serve the Kingdom
Halls around the world.

Did the governing body ever profess to be perfect? I challenge anyone to
find a statement in the publications where the governing body claims
perfection!

Matthew 19:21
21 Jesus said to him: "If you want to be perfect, go sell your belongings
and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my
follower."


Alright, so the governing body took Jesus up on his offer to "come and by my
follower" but skipped the part where Jesus said to first "go sell your
belongings and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven."

After all, suppose the governing body's response was "what if we don't want
to have treasure in heaven?" and they decided to keep that treasure on
earth? That could explain why they skipped the part about giving to the
poor, and proceeding to the last part, the part where Jesus said "come and
be my follower"?

There is always an explanation for why people do things! Now, whether they
make right or wrong choices, THAT is for YOU to decide!

So I ask you again to focus on this question:

Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?

THE CIRCUIT OVERSEER GAVE THE FOLLOWING LITMUS TEST TO ASK OURSELVES IF WE
BELONG TO AN ORGANIZATION THAT WILL BE SITTING ON CHRIST'S RIGHT SIDE:

34 "Then the king will say to those on his right, 'Come, YOU who have been
blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for YOU from the founding
of the world. 35 For I became hungry and YOU gave me something to eat; I got
thirsty and YOU gave me something to drink. I was a stranger and YOU
received me hospitably; 36 naked, and YOU clothed me. I fell sick and YOU
looked after me. I was in prison and YOU came to me.' (Matthew 25:34-36)


- Do we give those who are hungry something to eat?

- Do we give those who are thirsty something to drink?

- Do we receive strangers hospitably?

- Do we help those who are naked, sick, or in prison?


I'm personally not aware that any of the billions in contributions are going
to the aforementioned four areas of concern I just questioned?

Are you aware?

I'm only concerned because it's important for me personally -- as I'm sure
it is important for YOU personally -- to belong to an organization that can
reasonably believe it will be sitting on Jesus Christ's right side (Matthew
25:34-36).

Otherwise, what's the point of spending a lot of time going door to door.
Jesus Christ didn't exempt those who go door to door.

Christ instead laid in on the line in Matthew 25:34-36 quoted above.


Christ further made no mention of the preaching the good news of the kingdom
throughout the entire inhabited earth, as a witness to all the nations, when
he further said in continuation of the above quoted scriptures:

41 "Then he will say, in turn, to those on his left, 'Be on YOUR way from
me, YOU who have been cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the
Devil and his angels. 42 For I became hungry, but YOU gave me nothing to
eat, and I got thirsty, but YOU gave me nothing to drink. 43 I was a
stranger, but YOU did not receive me hospitably; naked, but YOU did not
clothe me; sick and in prison, but YOU did not look after me.' 44 Then they
also will answer with the words, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or
thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison and did not minister to
you?' 45 Then he will answer them with the words, 'Truly I say to YOU, To
the extent that YOU did not do it to one of these least ones, YOU did not do
it to me.' 46 And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the
righteous ones into everlasting life." (Matthew 25:41-46)


Why would ANYONE care about what anyone thinks, or whether they even get
expelled from an organization, if that religious organization is not giving
complete strangers in desperate POVERTY something to eat or drink, or
receive them hospitably because they are not members of their religious
affiliation, or help those sick and in prison -- WHEN CHRIST CLEARLY STATES
HE IS THOSE IMPOVERISHED INDIVIDUALS IN SPIRIT? By withholding helping the
poor is not a religious organization stabbing Jesus Christ in the back? I
guess so because that's exactly what Jesus Christ says in Matthew 25:41-46,
feeling so strongly against these organizations and individuals they risk
losing the gift of eternal life.

Obviously Christ takes CHARITY very seriously. So why would any religious
organization refuse to engage in charitable help toward the poor, in light
of what Jesus Christ said?

I'm especially puzzled when a religious organization with BILLIONS refuses
to spend one dime on helping the poor, ignoring Jesus Christ's wishes
expressed in Matthew 25:24-46, particularly when the organization's
GOVERNING BODY is so advanced in years they can't take these billions with
them?

Think about it... WHEN you are 97 years old, if you're blessed enough to
live that long, and you had access to BILLIONS that U.S. laws say you have
the legal authority to allocate to whatever cause you wish, would you

(a) help as many poor and impoverished people around the world as you can to
show Jesus Christ you take his words in Matthew 25:24-46 seriously, but
mainly because YOU LOVE YOUR FELLOW MAN? or

(b) bury the proverbial Master's "talents" (where the Master is symbolic for
Jesus Christ and the "talents" are billions in assets) safely in the ground
in the insured U.S. banking system which is the most powerful nation on
earth, doing nothing to help anyone who is impoverished (directing a
fraction of those assets to printing books at cost for loyal members of your
religious organization, doling out funds to rebuild Kingdom Hall facilities
owned by your religious corporation, and supporting two state-of-the-art
facilities in New York)?

If you said (a) then you obviously appreciate the importance to Jesus Christ
of charity and aiding the poor, as Jesus did his entire life.

If you said (b) then I can't resist asking, Are you a member of the current
GOVERNING BODY reading this newsgroup on a laptop over a wi-fi connection
from your comfortable quarters at Bethel?

If you said BOTH then you need to be one of the members of the GOVERNING
BODY!






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KrabLegs
2007-11-07 13:18:07 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Precision
The circuit overseer emphasized something very important regarding the
respect we should have toward the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses. The
governing body are more than advisors. There is something far greater going
on in Brooklyn and Patterson, something on an epic and historical scale!
Those who criticize the governing body simply do not fully appreciate the
full scope and grandeur of God's WIFE and OUR MOTHER. He cited the following
article from the October 1, 1950 issue of the Watchtower magazine...
*** w50 10/1 pp. 347-348 The Way of Success ***
VISIBLE REPRESENTATIVES LIKE HER
22 In this world it is customary to speak of a high school, college or
university from which a person graduates by the heathen expression "alma
mater" (fostering mother). But the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead is not
the great mother organization of the Gilead graduates. The Watch Tower Bible
& Tract Society is not the great mother organization of Jehovah's witnesses
who have received the Kingdom truth through it and who cooperate with it
world-wide, using it as their legal and business servant and advisory
governing body. No; as Jehovah's witnesses we represent something greater
than these minor visible organizations. The great "mother" is Jehovah's
universal organization, which he created and of which he is the faithful
Husband.
This requires a great leap of faith. DID Jehovah create anything related to
Jehovah's Witnesses, whether visible or invisible? The Watchtower has been
obsessed with dates and prophesies concerning dates since its formation, but as
we've seen, the Watchtower has been wrong again and again. But the Watchtower
still holds fast to their prediction that 1914 is a most significant date. In
fact it is so significant to the Jehovah's Witnesses, that to prove it to be in
error would cause the whole organization to collapse. In order for the
'prophetic' date of 1914 CE to be correct, Babylon had to have been destroyed in
607 BCE. But rather than establishing that 607 BCE is an unquestionable, fixed
date and then counting forward to 1914 CE, the Watchtower has determined that
1914 CE is the unquestionable, fixed date and then counted back to 607 BCE.
Since 1914 CE was the start of the Great War and this is unquestionably true
then that date cannot be changed by the Watchtower, but the 607 BCE date is
indeed questionable. In fact no one except the Jehovah's Witnesses agree with
that date as being anything significant at all.
Just think about it... How many WTBTS publications can you pick up that doesn't
have the 1914 date mentioned in it? Fixing dates is more important to the WTBTS
than showing love, compassion, and mercy. Their books are filled with charts,
diagrams, and predictions while basically ignoring the teachings of Jesus. Is
that what God had in mind? Does that represent what he wants his believers to
be spending their time doing?

(Isa. 54:5; Gal. 4:26) By her he brings forth his beloved children
Post by Precision
for his purpose. By her he gives us law and instruction,
There it is - right there. The WTBTS is imposing their laws upon its subjects.
Why? Why should we go beyond the Bible?
Post by Precision
provides for us,
The WTBTS does not provide for its subjects materially. The subjects provide
for the WTBTS materially. I've known a few men who served the WTBTS faithfully
throughout their whole adult life, never working enough to pay into the social
security system and then they became ill in their old age only to be totally
abandoned by the WTBTS. Is that what Jesus would have done?
Post by Precision
guides us and looks out for our welfare with a view to our everlasting life.
In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous woman so lovelily
described to King Lemuel.
On the surface you see smiling faces at the Kingdom Hall but just get down and
out and see how many come to your aid. The pioneers don't have time to help
anyone. The elders are swamped with 'busy' work. It was my experience that the
'spiritually sick' ones were the ones who most often offered assistance when I
needed it. I mentioned that to a circuit overseer once and he had no choice but
to agree with me. Just ask yourself, 'How many brothers and sisters at my
Kingdom Hall REALLY love me?' You should be able to name a few but be really
honest; do they love you because they are Jehovah's Witnesses or do they love
you because it is their nature to love you and would still have loved you
whether they knew anything about Jehovah's Witnesses or not?
Post by Precision
Just now, when God's kingdom is the paramount
issue, his "woman" is chiefly concerned with bringing forth successfully to
kingship with Jesus Christ in heaven the remnant of his royal "little flock".
Here the governing body is pumping themselves up. They are the little flock
because they say so. Be honest and ask this question, would you or anyone else
on this earth have come to the conclusion that the governing body is the 'little
flock' mentioned in the Bible if they hadn't said so?
Post by Precision
Yet she is interested also in the many, many "other sheep" who will
eventually become her earthly children in God's image and likeness. Her
heart is big enough to hold a love now for them all and to gather all these
"other sheep" to her warm, loving bosom.-Luke 12:32; John 10:16.
The governing body must not leave out the peons, the 'other sheep.' After
elevating themselves to the heavenly position next to Jesus Christ himself, they
must at least offer the other sheep a few crumbs left over from their feast.
Post by Precision
23 However, what we see exemplified in God's woman, his heavenly universal
organization, we should look to see in his visible organization. Why?
And here comes the leap of faith again. Would anyone on this planet come to the
conclusion that there is a heavenly universal organization if the governing body
hadn't said so.
Post by Precision
Because his higher, greater universal organization uses it as her earthly
instrument.
Because they said so. 'I am who I am because I said so.'
Post by Precision
That is why we do see those motherly traits, those traits and
acts of a virtuous woman, in the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and in
the Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, because these profess to represent
and serve God's woman. We thank God for providing and using them. So we
stand up respectfully and bless his faithful organization, his queenly
"woman" in heaven which makes all these loving provisions for us as children
of God.-Prov. 31:28.
You notice that the governing body wants their subjects to "stand up
respectfully and bless his faithful organization." If that doesn't raise red
flags then nothing will. Where in the Bible do we get the idea that we are to
worship an organization of men? And that's all we really have, don't we? An
organization of men who make grandiose claims that they are God's chosen ones,
and who make claims that they are the earthly remnant of those who will serve
with Jesus along with those who have already been raised from the dead to a
spiritual life in God's 'organization.'
Post by Precision
24 If we have an appreciation of all these truths, what shall we say is the
way of success? All the examples and the teachings of the Word of God agree
that it is the way marked by faithful, loving obedience to God and to the
commandments he issues through his Theocratic organization.
How arrogant are they? The governing body's subjects be must obedient to the
WTBTS's commandments! You see how they have replaced the Bible and even
replaced God with their 'Theocratic organization?'
Post by Precision
Hence keep in
touch with the central organization, God's Theocratic "woman".
There it is again! Worship the WTBTS!
Post by Precision
Keep in tune
with it by accepting the Theocratic organization rules and instructions
which God issues to us through it.
Again, the WTBTS is replacing the Bible with THEIR "rules and instructions." Of
course they add that God is giving them those "rules and instructions," but the
Bible plainly says to not add or take away from what is written. The Bible
gives more than enough instructions without a group of men adding to it.
Post by Precision
Never forsake these, but be teachable, as
trustful children. Hold fast to the Bible.
Of course, bow down and do obeisance to the WTBTS. The fact that they even
mention the Bible is to give them some sense of credibility.
Post by Precision
(End of quotation.)
How many reading this newsgroup JWs agree or disagree?
Pay special attention to the first sentence of paragraph 23!
Notice the article is NOT claiming the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is
"God's woman" or wife.
Rather, the article is simply pointing out what was emphasized in the
preceding paragraph, that Jehovah's "universal organization" that is OVER
his "visible organization" is a "virtuous woman."
How do we know that there's a "universal organization" other than because we are
told so by the WTBTS. 'It exists because we say it exists and we are its
earthly representation because we say so.'
Post by Precision
(In the preceding
paragraph it states, "In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous
woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel.") Therefore, paragraph 23 simply
points out that if the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is Jehovah's
"visible organization" that it must exemplify God's "heavenly universal
organization" it also refers to as God's spiritual "wife"!
Further, paragraph 23 also points out that the Watchtower Bible School of
Gilead and the Watchtower Society itself both "profess to represent and
serve God's woman." We are expected to "thank God for providing and using
them" (the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and Watchtower Society) because
they claim (or "represent") to "profess and serve God's woman."
Why do we believe what they claim in this regard. We believe because as the
preceding paragraph points out, "in her we find fulfilled all the traits of
a virtuous woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel."
As you have rightly questioned, are there traits of a virtuous woman?
Post by Precision
That may have been true in 1950.
Is it true today?
Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?
Do we thank God for providing and using them as the article says we surely
must do?
Does it ring true for us today that "her heart is big enough to hold a love
now for them all and to gather all these "other sheep" to her warm, loving
bosom"? (Luke 12:32; John 10:16.)
The governing body ARE the Watchtower Society.
Amen.
Post by Precision
They have signature authority. They control the Watchtower trust accounts
through major banking institutions. The very nature of the U.S. corporation
gives them authority over billions in real estate and assets.
Amen.
Post by Precision
Although they could have closed the Watchtower and legally retired as
billionaires due to the very nature of U.S. corporate laws for private
religious corporations, they selflessly chose to maintain and serve one of
the richest religious organizations next to the Mormon Church.
Have they really been selfless? I have known those who were very wealthy but
lived modestly. They didn't worship riches; they worshiped power and authority.
The governing body are worshiped day and night. They are waited on day and
night. They want for nothing. They have no every day life burdens or financial
worries. Virtually everything is provided for them.
They have absolute authority that presidents, kings, and queens would be jealous
off. Do you honestly think the President of the United States became president
for the money? What the President makes as a salary is pocket change for him,
and that has been the same for virtually every President of the US. But even
the President of the United States has only a fraction of the authority over his
subjects as the governing body has over its subjects. The governing body has
complete dictatorial authority over the WTBTS. They are unquestioned and
unchallengeable. There are men who would die to have such power.
Post by Precision
To this very
day, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses have been exemplary and
honest business men, burying the proverbial "talents" safely in the soils of
the banking system, real estate and securities holdings and other
financially safe instruments. These assets are buried safely under the
powers of modern financial laws in the United States of America, the most
powerful modern "empire" in human history, a nation to pale Rome and Egypt
by comparison. The Watchtower Society's treasures on earth serve the Kingdom
Halls around the world.
Did the governing body ever profess to be perfect? I challenge anyone to
find a statement in the publications where the governing body claims
perfection!
When a group of dictatorial men make absolute demands upon their subjects which
cannot be questioned, they are professing perfection! They are unchallengeable!
Disobedience of their rules results in punishment by spiritual death. How can
anyone claim more perfection than that?
Post by Precision
Matthew 19:21
21 Jesus said to him: "If you want to be perfect, go sell your belongings
and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my
follower."
Alright, so the governing body took Jesus up on his offer to "come and by my
follower" but skipped the part where Jesus said to first "go sell your
belongings and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven."
After all, suppose the governing body's response was "what if we don't want
to have treasure in heaven?" and they decided to keep that treasure on
earth? That could explain why they skipped the part about giving to the
poor, and proceeding to the last part, the part where Jesus said "come and
be my follower"?
There is always an explanation for why people do things! Now, whether they
make right or wrong choices, THAT is for YOU to decide!
Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?
THE CIRCUIT OVERSEER GAVE THE FOLLOWING LITMUS TEST TO ASK OURSELVES IF WE
34 "Then the king will say to those on his right, 'Come, YOU who have been
blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for YOU from the founding
of the world. 35 For I became hungry and YOU gave me something to eat; I got
thirsty and YOU gave me something to drink. I was a stranger and YOU
received me hospitably; 36 naked, and YOU clothed me. I fell sick and YOU
looked after me. I was in prison and YOU came to me.' (Matthew 25:34-36)
- Do we give those who are hungry something to eat?
- Do we give those who are thirsty something to drink?
- Do we receive strangers hospitably?
- Do we help those who are naked, sick, or in prison?
I'm personally not aware that any of the billions in contributions are going
to the aforementioned four areas of concern I just questioned?
Are you aware?
I'm only concerned because it's important for me personally -- as I'm sure
it is important for YOU personally -- to belong to an organization that can
reasonably believe it will be sitting on Jesus Christ's right side (Matthew
25:34-36).
Otherwise, what's the point of spending a lot of time going door to door.
Jesus Christ didn't exempt those who go door to door.
Christ instead laid in on the line in Matthew 25:34-36 quoted above.
Christ further made no mention of the preaching the good news of the kingdom
throughout the entire inhabited earth, as a witness to all the nations, when
41 "Then he will say, in turn, to those on his left, 'Be on YOUR way from
me, YOU who have been cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the
Devil and his angels. 42 For I became hungry, but YOU gave me nothing to
eat, and I got thirsty, but YOU gave me nothing to drink. 43 I was a
stranger, but YOU did not receive me hospitably; naked, but YOU did not
clothe me; sick and in prison, but YOU did not look after me.' 44 Then they
also will answer with the words, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or
thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison and did not minister to
you?' 45 Then he will answer them with the words, 'Truly I say to YOU, To
the extent that YOU did not do it to one of these least ones, YOU did not do
it to me.' 46 And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the
righteous ones into everlasting life." (Matthew 25:41-46)
Why would ANYONE care about what anyone thinks, or whether they even get
expelled from an organization, if that religious organization is not giving
complete strangers in desperate POVERTY something to eat or drink, or
receive them hospitably because they are not members of their religious
affiliation, or help those sick and in prison -- WHEN CHRIST CLEARLY STATES
HE IS THOSE IMPOVERISHED INDIVIDUALS IN SPIRIT? By withholding helping the
poor is not a religious organization stabbing Jesus Christ in the back? I
guess so because that's exactly what Jesus Christ says in Matthew 25:41-46,
feeling so strongly against these organizations and individuals they risk
losing the gift of eternal life.
Obviously Christ takes CHARITY very seriously. So why would any religious
organization refuse to engage in charitable help toward the poor, in light
of what Jesus Christ said?
I'm especially puzzled when a religious organization with BILLIONS refuses
to spend one dime on helping the poor, ignoring Jesus Christ's wishes
expressed in Matthew 25:24-46, particularly when the organization's
GOVERNING BODY is so advanced in years they can't take these billions with
them?
Think about it... WHEN you are 97 years old, if you're blessed enough to
live that long, and you had access to BILLIONS that U.S. laws say you have
the legal authority to allocate to whatever cause you wish, would you
(a) help as many poor and impoverished people around the world as you can to
show Jesus Christ you take his words in Matthew 25:24-46 seriously, but
mainly because YOU LOVE YOUR FELLOW MAN? or
(b) bury the proverbial Master's "talents" (where the Master is symbolic for
Jesus Christ and the "talents" are billions in assets) safely in the ground
in the insured U.S. banking system which is the most powerful nation on
earth, doing nothing to help anyone who is impoverished (directing a
fraction of those assets to printing books at cost for loyal members of your
religious organization, doling out funds to rebuild Kingdom Hall facilities
owned by your religious corporation, and supporting two state-of-the-art
facilities in New York)?
If you said (a) then you obviously appreciate the importance to Jesus Christ
of charity and aiding the poor, as Jesus did his entire life.
If you said (b) then I can't resist asking, Are you a member of the current
GOVERNING BODY reading this newsgroup on a laptop over a wi-fi connection
from your comfortable quarters at Bethel?
If you said BOTH then you need to be one of the members of the GOVERNING
BODY!
You already know the answers to your questions. Now it is up to you to decide
what you want to do about it.
~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
2007-11-07 16:07:53 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by KrabLegs
Post by Precision
The circuit overseer emphasized something very important regarding the
respect we should have toward the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses. The
governing body are more than advisors. There is something far greater going
on in Brooklyn and Patterson, something on an epic and historical scale!
Those who criticize the governing body simply do not fully appreciate the
full scope and grandeur of God's WIFE and OUR MOTHER. He cited the following
article from the October 1, 1950 issue of the Watchtower magazine...
*** w50 10/1 pp. 347-348 The Way of Success ***
VISIBLE REPRESENTATIVES LIKE HER
22 In this world it is customary to speak of a high school, college or
university from which a person graduates by the heathen expression "alma
mater" (fostering mother). But the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead is not
the great mother organization of the Gilead graduates. The Watch Tower Bible
& Tract Society is not the great mother organization of Jehovah's witnesses
who have received the Kingdom truth through it and who cooperate with it
world-wide, using it as their legal and business servant and advisory
governing body. No; as Jehovah's witnesses we represent something greater
than these minor visible organizations. The great "mother" is Jehovah's
universal organization, which he created and of which he is the faithful
Husband.
This requires a great leap of faith. DID Jehovah create anything related to
Jehovah's Witnesses, whether visible or invisible? The Watchtower has been
obsessed with dates and prophesies concerning dates since its formation, but as
we've seen, the Watchtower has been wrong again and again. But the Watchtower
still holds fast to their prediction that 1914 is a most significant date. In
fact it is so significant to the Jehovah's Witnesses, that to prove it to be in
error would cause the whole organization to collapse. In order for the
'prophetic' date of 1914 CE to be correct, Babylon had to have been destroyed in
607 BCE. But rather than establishing that 607 BCE is an unquestionable, fixed
date and then counting forward to 1914 CE, the Watchtower has determined that
1914 CE is the unquestionable, fixed date and then counted back to 607 BCE.
Since 1914 CE was the start of the Great War and this is unquestionably true
then that date cannot be changed by the Watchtower, but the 607 BCE date is
indeed questionable. In fact no one except the Jehovah's Witnesses agree with
that date as being anything significant at all.
Just think about it... How many WTBTS publications can you pick up that doesn't
have the 1914 date mentioned in it? Fixing dates is more important to the WTBTS
than showing love, compassion, and mercy. Their books are filled with charts,
diagrams, and predictions while basically ignoring the teachings of Jesus. Is
that what God had in mind? Does that represent what he wants his believers to
be spending their time doing?
(Isa. 54:5; Gal. 4:26) By her he brings forth his beloved children
Post by Precision
for his purpose. By her he gives us law and instruction,
There it is - right there. The WTBTS is imposing their laws upon its subjects.
Why? Why should we go beyond the Bible?
Post by Precision
provides for us,
The WTBTS does not provide for its subjects materially. The subjects provide
for the WTBTS materially. I've known a few men who served the WTBTS faithfully
throughout their whole adult life, never working enough to pay into the social
security system and then they became ill in their old age only to be totally
abandoned by the WTBTS. Is that what Jesus would have done?
Post by Precision
guides us and looks out for our welfare with a view to our everlasting life.
In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous woman so lovelily
described to King Lemuel.
On the surface you see smiling faces at the Kingdom Hall but just get down and
out and see how many come to your aid. The pioneers don't have time to help
anyone. The elders are swamped with 'busy' work. It was my experience that the
'spiritually sick' ones were the ones who most often offered assistance when I
needed it. I mentioned that to a circuit overseer once and he had no choice but
to agree with me. Just ask yourself, 'How many brothers and sisters at my
Kingdom Hall REALLY love me?' You should be able to name a few but be really
honest; do they love you because they are Jehovah's Witnesses or do they love
you because it is their nature to love you and would still have loved you
whether they knew anything about Jehovah's Witnesses or not?
Post by Precision
Just now, when God's kingdom is the paramount
issue, his "woman" is chiefly concerned with bringing forth successfully to
kingship with Jesus Christ in heaven the remnant of his royal "little flock".
Here the governing body is pumping themselves up. They are the little flock
because they say so. Be honest and ask this question, would you or anyone else
on this earth have come to the conclusion that the governing body is the 'little
flock' mentioned in the Bible if they hadn't said so?
Post by Precision
Yet she is interested also in the many, many "other sheep" who will
eventually become her earthly children in God's image and likeness. Her
heart is big enough to hold a love now for them all and to gather all these
"other sheep" to her warm, loving bosom.-Luke 12:32; John 10:16.
The governing body must not leave out the peons, the 'other sheep.' After
elevating themselves to the heavenly position next to Jesus Christ himself, they
must at least offer the other sheep a few crumbs left over from their feast.
Post by Precision
23 However, what we see exemplified in God's woman, his heavenly universal
organization, we should look to see in his visible organization. Why?
And here comes the leap of faith again. Would anyone on this planet come to the
conclusion that there is a heavenly universal organization if the governing body
hadn't said so.
Post by Precision
Because his higher, greater universal organization uses it as her earthly
instrument.
Because they said so. 'I am who I am because I said so.'
Post by Precision
That is why we do see those motherly traits, those traits and
acts of a virtuous woman, in the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and in
the Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, because these profess to represent
and serve God's woman. We thank God for providing and using them. So we
stand up respectfully and bless his faithful organization, his queenly
"woman" in heaven which makes all these loving provisions for us as children
of God.-Prov. 31:28.
You notice that the governing body wants their subjects to "stand up
respectfully and bless his faithful organization." If that doesn't raise red
flags then nothing will. Where in the Bible do we get the idea that we are to
worship an organization of men? And that's all we really have, don't we? An
organization of men who make grandiose claims that they are God's chosen ones,
and who make claims that they are the earthly remnant of those who will serve
with Jesus along with those who have already been raised from the dead to a
spiritual life in God's 'organization.'
Post by Precision
24 If we have an appreciation of all these truths, what shall we say is the
way of success? All the examples and the teachings of the Word of God agree
that it is the way marked by faithful, loving obedience to God and to the
commandments he issues through his Theocratic organization.
How arrogant are they? The governing body's subjects be must obedient to the
WTBTS's commandments! You see how they have replaced the Bible and even
replaced God with their 'Theocratic organization?'
Post by Precision
Hence keep in
touch with the central organization, God's Theocratic "woman".
There it is again! Worship the WTBTS!
Post by Precision
Keep in tune
with it by accepting the Theocratic organization rules and instructions
which God issues to us through it.
Again, the WTBTS is replacing the Bible with THEIR "rules and instructions." Of
course they add that God is giving them those "rules and instructions," but the
Bible plainly says to not add or take away from what is written. The Bible
gives more than enough instructions without a group of men adding to it.
Post by Precision
Never forsake these, but be teachable, as
trustful children. Hold fast to the Bible.
Of course, bow down and do obeisance to the WTBTS. The fact that they even
mention the Bible is to give them some sense of credibility.
Post by Precision
(End of quotation.)
How many reading this newsgroup JWs agree or disagree?
Pay special attention to the first sentence of paragraph 23!
Notice the article is NOT claiming the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is
"God's woman" or wife.
Rather, the article is simply pointing out what was emphasized in the
preceding paragraph, that Jehovah's "universal organization" that is OVER
his "visible organization" is a "virtuous woman."
How do we know that there's a "universal organization" other than because we are
told so by the WTBTS. 'It exists because we say it exists and we are its
earthly representation because we say so.'
Post by Precision
(In the preceding
paragraph it states, "In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous
woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel.") Therefore, paragraph 23 simply
points out that if the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is Jehovah's
"visible organization" that it must exemplify God's "heavenly universal
organization" it also refers to as God's spiritual "wife"!
Further, paragraph 23 also points out that the Watchtower Bible School of
Gilead and the Watchtower Society itself both "profess to represent and
serve God's woman." We are expected to "thank God for providing and using
them" (the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and Watchtower Society) because
they claim (or "represent") to "profess and serve God's woman."
Why do we believe what they claim in this regard. We believe because as the
preceding paragraph points out, "in her we find fulfilled all the traits of
a virtuous woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel."
As you have rightly questioned, are there traits of a virtuous woman?
Post by Precision
That may have been true in 1950.
Is it true today?
Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?
Do we thank God for providing and using them as the article says we surely
must do?
Does it ring true for us today that "her heart is big enough to hold a love
now for them all and to gather all these "other sheep" to her warm, loving
bosom"? (Luke 12:32; John 10:16.)
The governing body ARE the Watchtower Society.
Amen.
Post by Precision
They have signature authority. They control the Watchtower trust accounts
through major banking institutions. The very nature of the U.S. corporation
gives them authority over billions in real estate and assets.
Amen.
Post by Precision
Although they could have closed the Watchtower and legally retired as
billionaires due to the very nature of U.S. corporate laws for private
religious corporations, they selflessly chose to maintain and serve one of
the richest religious organizations next to the Mormon Church.
Have they really been selfless? I have known those who were very wealthy but
lived modestly. They didn't worship riches; they worshiped power and authority.
The governing body are worshiped day and night. They are waited on day and
night. They want for nothing. They have no every day life burdens or financial
worries. Virtually everything is provided for them.
They have absolute authority that presidents, kings, and queens would be jealous
off. Do you honestly think the President of the United States became president
for the money? What the President makes as a salary is pocket change for him,
and that has been the same for virtually every President of the US. But even
the President of the United States has only a fraction of the authority over his
subjects as the governing body has over its subjects. The governing body has
complete dictatorial authority over the WTBTS. They are unquestioned and
unchallengeable. There are men who would die to have such power.
Post by Precision
To this very
day, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses have been exemplary and
honest business men, burying the proverbial "talents" safely in the soils of
the banking system, real estate and securities holdings and other
financially safe instruments. These assets are buried safely under the
powers of modern financial laws in the United States of America, the most
powerful modern "empire" in human history, a nation to pale Rome and Egypt
by comparison. The Watchtower Society's treasures on earth serve the Kingdom
Halls around the world.
Did the governing body ever profess to be perfect? I challenge anyone to
find a statement in the publications where the governing body claims
perfection!
When a group of dictatorial men make absolute demands upon their subjects which
cannot be questioned, they are professing perfection! They are unchallengeable!
Disobedience of their rules results in punishment by spiritual death. How can
anyone claim more perfection than that?
Post by Precision
Matthew 19:21
21 Jesus said to him: "If you want to be perfect, go sell your belongings
and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my
follower."
Alright, so the governing body took Jesus up on his offer to "come and by my
follower" but skipped the part where Jesus said to first "go sell your
belongings and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven."
After all, suppose the governing body's response was "what if we don't want
to have treasure in heaven?" and they decided to keep that treasure on
earth? That could explain why they skipped the part about giving to the
poor, and proceeding to the last part, the part where Jesus said "come and
be my follower"?
There is always an explanation for why people do things! Now, whether they
make right or wrong choices, THAT is for YOU to decide!
Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?
THE CIRCUIT OVERSEER GAVE THE FOLLOWING LITMUS TEST TO ASK OURSELVES IF WE
34 "Then the king will say to those on his right, 'Come, YOU who have been
blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for YOU from the founding
of the world. 35 For I became hungry and YOU gave me something to eat; I got
thirsty and YOU gave me something to drink. I was a stranger and YOU
received me hospitably; 36 naked, and YOU clothed me. I fell sick and YOU
looked after me. I was in prison and YOU came to me.' (Matthew 25:34-36)
- Do we give those who are hungry something to eat?
- Do we give those who are thirsty something to drink?
- Do we receive strangers hospitably?
- Do we help those who are naked, sick, or in prison?
I'm personally not aware that any of the billions in contributions are going
to the aforementioned four areas of concern I just questioned?
Are you aware?
I'm only concerned because it's important for me personally -- as I'm sure
it is important for YOU personally -- to belong to an organization that can
reasonably believe it will be sitting on Jesus Christ's right side (Matthew
25:34-36).
Otherwise, what's the point of spending a lot of time going door to door.
Jesus Christ didn't exempt those who go door to door.
Christ instead laid in on the line in Matthew 25:34-36 quoted above.
Christ further made no mention of the preaching the good news of the kingdom
throughout the entire inhabited earth, as a witness to all the nations, when
41 "Then he will say, in turn, to those on his left, 'Be on YOUR way from
me, YOU who have been cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the
Devil and his angels. 42 For I became hungry, but YOU gave me nothing to
eat, and I got thirsty, but YOU gave me nothing to drink. 43 I was a
stranger, but YOU did not receive me hospitably; naked, but YOU did not
clothe me; sick and in prison, but YOU did not look after me.' 44 Then they
also will answer with the words, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or
thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison and did not minister to
you?' 45 Then he will answer them with the words, 'Truly I say to YOU, To
the extent that YOU did not do it to one of these least ones, YOU did not do
it to me.' 46 And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the
righteous ones into everlasting life." (Matthew 25:41-46)
Why would ANYONE care about what anyone thinks, or whether they even get
expelled from an organization, if that religious organization is not giving
complete strangers in desperate POVERTY something to eat or drink, or
receive them hospitably because they are not members of their religious
affiliation, or help those sick and in prison -- WHEN CHRIST CLEARLY STATES
HE IS THOSE IMPOVERISHED INDIVIDUALS IN SPIRIT? By withholding helping the
poor is not a religious organization stabbing Jesus Christ in the back? I
guess so because that's exactly what Jesus Christ says in Matthew 25:41-46,
feeling so strongly against these organizations and individuals they risk
losing the gift of eternal life.
Obviously Christ takes CHARITY very seriously. So why would any religious
organization refuse to engage in charitable help toward the poor, in light
of what Jesus Christ said?
I'm especially puzzled when a religious organization with BILLIONS refuses
to spend one dime on helping the poor, ignoring Jesus Christ's wishes
expressed in Matthew 25:24-46, particularly when the organization's
GOVERNING BODY is so advanced in years they can't take these billions with
them?
Think about it... WHEN you are 97 years old, if you're blessed enough to
live that long, and you had access to BILLIONS that U.S. laws say you have
the legal authority to allocate to whatever cause you wish, would you
(a) help as many poor and impoverished people around the world as you can to
show Jesus Christ you take his words in Matthew 25:24-46 seriously, but
mainly because YOU LOVE YOUR FELLOW MAN? or
(b) bury the proverbial Master's "talents" (where the Master is symbolic for
Jesus Christ and the "talents" are billions in assets) safely in the ground
in the insured U.S. banking system which is the most powerful nation on
earth, doing nothing to help anyone who is impoverished (directing a
fraction of those assets to printing books at cost for loyal members of your
religious organization, doling out funds to rebuild Kingdom Hall facilities
owned by your religious corporation, and supporting two state-of-the-art
facilities in New York)?
If you said (a) then you obviously appreciate the importance to Jesus Christ
of charity and aiding the poor, as Jesus did his entire life.
If you said (b) then I can't resist asking, Are you a member of the current
GOVERNING BODY reading this newsgroup on a laptop over a wi-fi connection
from your comfortable quarters at Bethel?
If you said BOTH then you need to be one of the members of the GOVERNING
BODY!
You already know the answers to your questions. Now it is up to you to decide
what you want to do about it.
All this proves that the WTS and its men should not be touched by a 60 ft pole!
I've never read so much self boast, "To this very
day, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses have been exemplary and
honest business men, burying the proverbial "talents" safely in the soils of
the banking system, real estate and securities holdings and other
financially safe instruments. These assets are buried safely under the
powers of modern financial laws in the United States of America, the most
powerful modern "empire" in human history, a nation to pale Rome and Egypt
by comparison. The Watchtower Society's treasures on earth serve the Kingdom
Halls around the world."..
My God, can they get any more self glorifying, more demanding
of total loyalty (something that only belongs to God) if they tried? They, the JW's
should be thankful that they don't spend the billions on themselves, as the US laws
says they could! I want to puke!

Aren't they supposed to be out of this world, go out of it?They have the nuts to
quote Jesus,he said to him: "If you want to be perfect, go sell your belongings
and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my
follower." The WTS gives nothing, but are overincorporated into their own
financial bankaccounts, using it for themselves, for their empire. They sure do
compare themselves to the Roman og Egyptian empires. They're full of themselves,
more disgusting than I thought disgusting could be.They're disgust personified.

They indeed skiped what Jesus said, they skip everything Jesus said in real life,
because by God, they're above Jesus Christ, they're their own empire and King
and wife, there's no comparison to this grande Society, in their own eyes! It
not only shows in these things they say, it comes out full force, how they really
view themselves, what the Governing Body really is to themselves, that everybody
else simply MUST follow.

These are the things only people in the Halls get to hear, they won't put this in the
mags (that they've separated into two parts, one for public, one for their Halls).
No wonder! Everybody with half a braincell would be repelled!

The WTS realizes their position is severly challenged. This is a big red flag that
shows who they are and who they were all along.

Saba
Kathy
2007-11-07 20:55:37 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
All this proves that the WTS and its men should not be touched by a 60 ft pole!
I've never read so much self boast, "To this very
day, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses have been exemplary and
honest business men, burying the proverbial "talents" safely in the soils of
the banking system, real estate and securities holdings and other
financially safe instruments. These assets are buried safely under the
powers of modern financial laws in the United States of America, the most
powerful modern "empire" in human history, a nation to pale Rome and Egypt
by comparison. The Watchtower Society's treasures on earth serve the Kingdom
Halls around the world."..
My God, can they get any more self glorifying, more demanding
of total loyalty (something that only belongs to God) if they tried? They, the JW's
should be thankful that they don't spend the billions on themselves, as the US laws
says they could! I want to puke!
Aren't they supposed to be out of this world, go out of it?They have the nuts to
quote Jesus,he said to him: "If you want to be perfect, go sell your belongings
and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my
follower." The WTS gives nothing, but are overincorporated into their own
financial bankaccounts, using it for themselves, for their empire. They sure do
compare themselves to the Roman og Egyptian empires. They're full of themselves,
more disgusting than I thought disgusting could be.They're disgust personified.
They indeed skiped what Jesus said, they skip everything Jesus said in real life,
because by God, they're above Jesus Christ, they're their own empire and King
and wife, there's no comparison to this grande Society, in their own eyes! It
not only shows in these things they say, it comes out full force, how they really
view themselves, what the Governing Body really is to themselves, that everybody
else simply MUST follow.
These are the things only people in the Halls get to hear, they won't put this in the
mags (that they've separated into two parts, one for public, one for their Halls).
No wonder! Everybody with half a braincell would be repelled!
The WTS realizes their position is severly challenged. This is a big red flag that
shows who they are and who they were all along.
Saba
Another of your excellent posts Saba. I repost all of it for posterity.
They are the false prophets we were all warned about and Precision has once
again put his blinders firmly in place rather than face the truth and
reality.
~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
2007-11-07 23:04:10 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
All this proves that the WTS and its men should not be touched by a 60 ft pole!
I've never read so much self boast, "To this very
day, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses have been exemplary and
honest business men, burying the proverbial "talents" safely in the soils of
the banking system, real estate and securities holdings and other
financially safe instruments. These assets are buried safely under the
powers of modern financial laws in the United States of America, the most
powerful modern "empire" in human history, a nation to pale Rome and Egypt
by comparison. The Watchtower Society's treasures on earth serve the Kingdom
Halls around the world."..
My God, can they get any more self glorifying, more demanding
of total loyalty (something that only belongs to God) if they tried? They, the JW's
should be thankful that they don't spend the billions on themselves, as the US laws
says they could! I want to puke!
Aren't they supposed to be out of this world, go out of it?They have the nuts to
quote Jesus,he said to him: "If you want to be perfect, go sell your belongings
and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my
follower." The WTS gives nothing, but are overincorporated into their own
financial bankaccounts, using it for themselves, for their empire. They sure do
compare themselves to the Roman og Egyptian empires. They're full of themselves,
more disgusting than I thought disgusting could be.They're disgust personified.
They indeed skiped what Jesus said, they skip everything Jesus said in real life,
because by God, they're above Jesus Christ, they're their own empire and King
and wife, there's no comparison to this grande Society, in their own eyes! It
not only shows in these things they say, it comes out full force, how they really
view themselves, what the Governing Body really is to themselves, that everybody
else simply MUST follow.
These are the things only people in the Halls get to hear, they won't put this in the
mags (that they've separated into two parts, one for public, one for their Halls).
No wonder! Everybody with half a braincell would be repelled!
The WTS realizes their position is severly challenged. This is a big red flag that
shows who they are and who they were all along.
Saba
Another of your excellent posts Saba. I repost all of it for posterity. They are the false
prophets we were all warned about and Precision has once again put his blinders firmly in place
rather than face the truth and reality.
Yes good, so Precision can read my posts as well, for whatever reason she can't..

Saba
~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
2007-11-07 23:10:18 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
All this proves that the WTS and its men should not be touched by a 60 ft pole!
I've never read so much self boast, "To this very
day, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses have been exemplary and
honest business men, burying the proverbial "talents" safely in the soils of
the banking system, real estate and securities holdings and other
financially safe instruments. These assets are buried safely under the
powers of modern financial laws in the United States of America, the most
powerful modern "empire" in human history, a nation to pale Rome and Egypt
by comparison. The Watchtower Society's treasures on earth serve the Kingdom
Halls around the world."..
My God, can they get any more self glorifying, more demanding
of total loyalty (something that only belongs to God) if they tried? They, the JW's
should be thankful that they don't spend the billions on themselves, as the US laws
says they could! I want to puke!
Aren't they supposed to be out of this world, go out of it?They have the nuts to
quote Jesus,he said to him: "If you want to be perfect, go sell your belongings
and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my
follower." The WTS gives nothing, but are overincorporated into their own
financial bankaccounts, using it for themselves, for their empire. They sure do
compare themselves to the Roman og Egyptian empires. They're full of themselves,
more disgusting than I thought disgusting could be.They're disgust personified.
They indeed skiped what Jesus said, they skip everything Jesus said in real life,
because by God, they're above Jesus Christ, they're their own empire and King
and wife, there's no comparison to this grande Society, in their own eyes! It
not only shows in these things they say, it comes out full force, how they really
view themselves, what the Governing Body really is to themselves, that everybody
else simply MUST follow.
These are the things only people in the Halls get to hear, they won't put this in the
mags (that they've separated into two parts, one for public, one for their Halls).
No wonder! Everybody with half a braincell would be repelled!
The WTS realizes their position is severly challenged. This is a big red flag that
shows who they are and who they were all along.
Saba
Another of your excellent posts Saba. I repost all of it for posterity. They are the false
prophets we were all warned about and Precision has once again put his blinders firmly in place
rather than face the truth and reality.
Yes good, so Precision can read my posts as well, for whatever reason she can't..
Ehm, HE can't. Dunno why I think it's a woman all the time..lol

Saba
Precision
2007-11-09 06:21:37 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by KrabLegs
Post by Precision
The circuit overseer emphasized something very important regarding the
respect we should have toward the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses. The
governing body are more than advisors. There is something far greater going
on in Brooklyn and Patterson, something on an epic and historical scale!
Those who criticize the governing body simply do not fully appreciate the
full scope and grandeur of God's WIFE and OUR MOTHER. He cited the following
article from the October 1, 1950 issue of the Watchtower magazine...
*** w50 10/1 pp. 347-348 The Way of Success ***
VISIBLE REPRESENTATIVES LIKE HER
22 In this world it is customary to speak of a high school, college or
university from which a person graduates by the heathen expression "alma
mater" (fostering mother). But the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead is not
the great mother organization of the Gilead graduates. The Watch Tower Bible
& Tract Society is not the great mother organization of Jehovah's witnesses
who have received the Kingdom truth through it and who cooperate with it
world-wide, using it as their legal and business servant and advisory
governing body. No; as Jehovah's witnesses we represent something greater
than these minor visible organizations. The great "mother" is Jehovah's
universal organization, which he created and of which he is the faithful
Husband.
This requires a great leap of faith. DID Jehovah create anything related to
Jehovah's Witnesses, whether visible or invisible? The Watchtower has been
obsessed with dates and prophesies concerning dates since its formation, but as
we've seen, the Watchtower has been wrong again and again. But the Watchtower
still holds fast to their prediction that 1914 is a most significant date.
In
fact it is so significant to the Jehovah's Witnesses, that to prove it to be in
error would cause the whole organization to collapse. In order for the
'prophetic' date of 1914 CE to be correct, Babylon had to have been destroyed in
607 BCE. But rather than establishing that 607 BCE is an unquestionable, fixed
date and then counting forward to 1914 CE, the Watchtower has determined that
1914 CE is the unquestionable, fixed date and then counted back to 607 BCE.
Since 1914 CE was the start of the Great War and this is unquestionably true
then that date cannot be changed by the Watchtower, but the 607 BCE date is
indeed questionable. In fact no one except the Jehovah's Witnesses agree with
that date as being anything significant at all.
Just think about it... How many WTBTS publications can you pick up that doesn't
have the 1914 date mentioned in it? Fixing dates is more important to the WTBTS
than showing love, compassion, and mercy. Their books are filled with charts,
diagrams, and predictions while basically ignoring the teachings of Jesus.
Is
that what God had in mind? Does that represent what he wants his believers to
be spending their time doing?
(Isa. 54:5; Gal. 4:26) By her he brings forth his beloved children
Post by Precision
for his purpose. By her he gives us law and instruction,
There it is - right there. The WTBTS is imposing their laws upon its subjects.
Why? Why should we go beyond the Bible?
Post by Precision
provides for us,
The WTBTS does not provide for its subjects materially. The subjects provide
for the WTBTS materially. I've known a few men who served the WTBTS faithfully
throughout their whole adult life, never working enough to pay into the social
security system and then they became ill in their old age only to be totally
abandoned by the WTBTS. Is that what Jesus would have done?
Post by Precision
guides us and looks out for our welfare with a view to our everlasting life.
In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous woman so lovelily
described to King Lemuel.
On the surface you see smiling faces at the Kingdom Hall but just get down and
out and see how many come to your aid. The pioneers don't have time to help
anyone. The elders are swamped with 'busy' work. It was my experience that the
'spiritually sick' ones were the ones who most often offered assistance when I
needed it. I mentioned that to a circuit overseer once and he had no choice but
to agree with me. Just ask yourself, 'How many brothers and sisters at my
Kingdom Hall REALLY love me?' You should be able to name a few but be really
honest; do they love you because they are Jehovah's Witnesses or do they love
you because it is their nature to love you and would still have loved you
whether they knew anything about Jehovah's Witnesses or not?
Post by Precision
Just now, when God's kingdom is the paramount
issue, his "woman" is chiefly concerned with bringing forth successfully to
kingship with Jesus Christ in heaven the remnant of his royal "little flock".
Here the governing body is pumping themselves up. They are the little flock
because they say so. Be honest and ask this question, would you or anyone else
on this earth have come to the conclusion that the governing body is the 'little
flock' mentioned in the Bible if they hadn't said so?
Post by Precision
Yet she is interested also in the many, many "other sheep" who will
eventually become her earthly children in God's image and likeness. Her
heart is big enough to hold a love now for them all and to gather all these
"other sheep" to her warm, loving bosom.-Luke 12:32; John 10:16.
The governing body must not leave out the peons, the 'other sheep.' After
elevating themselves to the heavenly position next to Jesus Christ himself, they
must at least offer the other sheep a few crumbs left over from their feast.
Post by Precision
23 However, what we see exemplified in God's woman, his heavenly universal
organization, we should look to see in his visible organization. Why?
And here comes the leap of faith again. Would anyone on this planet come to the
conclusion that there is a heavenly universal organization if the governing body
hadn't said so.
Post by Precision
Because his higher, greater universal organization uses it as her earthly
instrument.
Because they said so. 'I am who I am because I said so.'
Post by Precision
That is why we do see those motherly traits, those traits and
acts of a virtuous woman, in the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and in
the Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, because these profess to represent
and serve God's woman. We thank God for providing and using them. So we
stand up respectfully and bless his faithful organization, his queenly
"woman" in heaven which makes all these loving provisions for us as children
of God.-Prov. 31:28.
You notice that the governing body wants their subjects to "stand up
respectfully and bless his faithful organization." If that doesn't raise red
flags then nothing will. Where in the Bible do we get the idea that we are to
worship an organization of men? And that's all we really have, don't we?
An
organization of men who make grandiose claims that they are God's chosen ones,
and who make claims that they are the earthly remnant of those who will serve
with Jesus along with those who have already been raised from the dead to a
spiritual life in God's 'organization.'
Post by Precision
24 If we have an appreciation of all these truths, what shall we say is the
way of success? All the examples and the teachings of the Word of God agree
that it is the way marked by faithful, loving obedience to God and to the
commandments he issues through his Theocratic organization.
How arrogant are they? The governing body's subjects be must obedient to the
WTBTS's commandments! You see how they have replaced the Bible and even
replaced God with their 'Theocratic organization?'
Post by Precision
Hence keep in
touch with the central organization, God's Theocratic "woman".
There it is again! Worship the WTBTS!
Post by Precision
Keep in tune
with it by accepting the Theocratic organization rules and instructions
which God issues to us through it.
Again, the WTBTS is replacing the Bible with THEIR "rules and
instructions." Of
course they add that God is giving them those "rules and instructions," but the
Bible plainly says to not add or take away from what is written. The Bible
gives more than enough instructions without a group of men adding to it.
Post by Precision
Never forsake these, but be teachable, as
trustful children. Hold fast to the Bible.
Of course, bow down and do obeisance to the WTBTS. The fact that they even
mention the Bible is to give them some sense of credibility.
Post by Precision
(End of quotation.)
How many reading this newsgroup JWs agree or disagree?
Pay special attention to the first sentence of paragraph 23!
Notice the article is NOT claiming the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is
"God's woman" or wife.
Rather, the article is simply pointing out what was emphasized in the
preceding paragraph, that Jehovah's "universal organization" that is OVER
his "visible organization" is a "virtuous woman."
How do we know that there's a "universal organization" other than because we are
told so by the WTBTS. 'It exists because we say it exists and we are its
earthly representation because we say so.'
Post by Precision
(In the preceding
paragraph it states, "In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous
woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel.") Therefore, paragraph 23 simply
points out that if the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is Jehovah's
"visible organization" that it must exemplify God's "heavenly universal
organization" it also refers to as God's spiritual "wife"!
Further, paragraph 23 also points out that the Watchtower Bible School of
Gilead and the Watchtower Society itself both "profess to represent and
serve God's woman." We are expected to "thank God for providing and using
them" (the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and Watchtower Society) because
they claim (or "represent") to "profess and serve God's woman."
Why do we believe what they claim in this regard. We believe because as the
preceding paragraph points out, "in her we find fulfilled all the traits of
a virtuous woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel."
As you have rightly questioned, are there traits of a virtuous woman?
Post by Precision
That may have been true in 1950.
Is it true today?
Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?
Do we thank God for providing and using them as the article says we surely
must do?
Does it ring true for us today that "her heart is big enough to hold a love
now for them all and to gather all these "other sheep" to her warm, loving
bosom"? (Luke 12:32; John 10:16.)
The governing body ARE the Watchtower Society.
Amen.
Post by Precision
They have signature authority. They control the Watchtower trust accounts
through major banking institutions. The very nature of the U.S. corporation
gives them authority over billions in real estate and assets.
Amen.
Post by Precision
Although they could have closed the Watchtower and legally retired as
billionaires due to the very nature of U.S. corporate laws for private
religious corporations, they selflessly chose to maintain and serve one of
the richest religious organizations next to the Mormon Church.
Have they really been selfless? I have known those who were very wealthy but
lived modestly. They didn't worship riches; they worshiped power and authority.
The governing body are worshiped day and night. They are waited on day and
night. They want for nothing. They have no every day life burdens or financial
worries. Virtually everything is provided for them.
They have absolute authority that presidents, kings, and queens would be jealous
off. Do you honestly think the President of the United States became president
for the money? What the President makes as a salary is pocket change for him,
and that has been the same for virtually every President of the US. But even
the President of the United States has only a fraction of the authority over his
subjects as the governing body has over its subjects. The governing body has
complete dictatorial authority over the WTBTS. They are unquestioned and
unchallengeable. There are men who would die to have such power.
Post by Precision
To this very
day, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses have been exemplary and
honest business men, burying the proverbial "talents" safely in the soils of
the banking system, real estate and securities holdings and other
financially safe instruments. These assets are buried safely under the
powers of modern financial laws in the United States of America, the most
powerful modern "empire" in human history, a nation to pale Rome and Egypt
by comparison. The Watchtower Society's treasures on earth serve the Kingdom
Halls around the world.
Did the governing body ever profess to be perfect? I challenge anyone to
find a statement in the publications where the governing body claims
perfection!
When a group of dictatorial men make absolute demands upon their subjects which
cannot be questioned, they are professing perfection! They are unchallengeable!
Disobedience of their rules results in punishment by spiritual death. How can
anyone claim more perfection than that?
Post by Precision
Matthew 19:21
21 Jesus said to him: "If you want to be perfect, go sell your belongings
and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my
follower."
Alright, so the governing body took Jesus up on his offer to "come and by my
follower" but skipped the part where Jesus said to first "go sell your
belongings and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven."
After all, suppose the governing body's response was "what if we don't want
to have treasure in heaven?" and they decided to keep that treasure on
earth? That could explain why they skipped the part about giving to the
poor, and proceeding to the last part, the part where Jesus said "come and
be my follower"?
There is always an explanation for why people do things! Now, whether they
make right or wrong choices, THAT is for YOU to decide!
Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?
THE CIRCUIT OVERSEER GAVE THE FOLLOWING LITMUS TEST TO ASK OURSELVES IF WE
34 "Then the king will say to those on his right, 'Come, YOU who have been
blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for YOU from the founding
of the world. 35 For I became hungry and YOU gave me something to eat; I got
thirsty and YOU gave me something to drink. I was a stranger and YOU
received me hospitably; 36 naked, and YOU clothed me. I fell sick and YOU
looked after me. I was in prison and YOU came to me.' (Matthew 25:34-36)
- Do we give those who are hungry something to eat?
- Do we give those who are thirsty something to drink?
- Do we receive strangers hospitably?
- Do we help those who are naked, sick, or in prison?
I'm personally not aware that any of the billions in contributions are going
to the aforementioned four areas of concern I just questioned?
Are you aware?
I'm only concerned because it's important for me personally -- as I'm sure
it is important for YOU personally -- to belong to an organization that can
reasonably believe it will be sitting on Jesus Christ's right side (Matthew
25:34-36).
Otherwise, what's the point of spending a lot of time going door to door.
Jesus Christ didn't exempt those who go door to door.
Christ instead laid in on the line in Matthew 25:34-36 quoted above.
Christ further made no mention of the preaching the good news of the kingdom
throughout the entire inhabited earth, as a witness to all the nations, when
41 "Then he will say, in turn, to those on his left, 'Be on YOUR way from
me, YOU who have been cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the
Devil and his angels. 42 For I became hungry, but YOU gave me nothing to
eat, and I got thirsty, but YOU gave me nothing to drink. 43 I was a
stranger, but YOU did not receive me hospitably; naked, but YOU did not
clothe me; sick and in prison, but YOU did not look after me.' 44 Then they
also will answer with the words, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or
thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison and did not minister to
you?' 45 Then he will answer them with the words, 'Truly I say to YOU, To
the extent that YOU did not do it to one of these least ones, YOU did not do
it to me.' 46 And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the
righteous ones into everlasting life." (Matthew 25:41-46)
Why would ANYONE care about what anyone thinks, or whether they even get
expelled from an organization, if that religious organization is not giving
complete strangers in desperate POVERTY something to eat or drink, or
receive them hospitably because they are not members of their religious
affiliation, or help those sick and in prison -- WHEN CHRIST CLEARLY STATES
HE IS THOSE IMPOVERISHED INDIVIDUALS IN SPIRIT? By withholding helping the
poor is not a religious organization stabbing Jesus Christ in the back? I
guess so because that's exactly what Jesus Christ says in Matthew 25:41-46,
feeling so strongly against these organizations and individuals they risk
losing the gift of eternal life.
Obviously Christ takes CHARITY very seriously. So why would any religious
organization refuse to engage in charitable help toward the poor, in light
of what Jesus Christ said?
I'm especially puzzled when a religious organization with BILLIONS refuses
to spend one dime on helping the poor, ignoring Jesus Christ's wishes
expressed in Matthew 25:24-46, particularly when the organization's
GOVERNING BODY is so advanced in years they can't take these billions with
them?
Think about it... WHEN you are 97 years old, if you're blessed enough to
live that long, and you had access to BILLIONS that U.S. laws say you have
the legal authority to allocate to whatever cause you wish, would you
(a) help as many poor and impoverished people around the world as you can to
show Jesus Christ you take his words in Matthew 25:24-46 seriously, but
mainly because YOU LOVE YOUR FELLOW MAN? or
(b) bury the proverbial Master's "talents" (where the Master is symbolic for
Jesus Christ and the "talents" are billions in assets) safely in the ground
in the insured U.S. banking system which is the most powerful nation on
earth, doing nothing to help anyone who is impoverished (directing a
fraction of those assets to printing books at cost for loyal members of your
religious organization, doling out funds to rebuild Kingdom Hall facilities
owned by your religious corporation, and supporting two state-of-the-art
facilities in New York)?
If you said (a) then you obviously appreciate the importance to Jesus Christ
of charity and aiding the poor, as Jesus did his entire life.
If you said (b) then I can't resist asking, Are you a member of the current
GOVERNING BODY reading this newsgroup on a laptop over a wi-fi connection
from your comfortable quarters at Bethel?
If you said BOTH then you need to be one of the members of the GOVERNING
BODY!
You already know the answers to your questions. Now it is up to you to decide
what you want to do about it.
Your commentaries are always insightful.

As to your very last comment to my questions, it is interesting you ask just
now. I just finished watching 'V For Vendetta', I happened to catch its
eye-opening ending again while channel-surfing and couldn't resist seeing it
again. Rent this movie something, and you may understand my pragmatic
sentiments on this matter. The true irony is the ending is symbolic of what
the governing body always seemed to feel is the necessary solution to the
woes of 'this system of things' brought about by its power-hungry political
leaders.

Perhaps I don't have the strength let alone the chutzpah to participate in
the closure or 'reformation' of the administrative nightmare plaguing the
organization, but I sense someone who has nothing to loose very well might
be planning to do so. In any case, V's ending is the kind of closure worthy
of any situation where a few humans have absolute authority over so many.
The role of the head of Scotland Yard in the film especially riveted me.
There are those in Bethel who would likely view a long overdue change of the
so-called 'slave class' with similar stoic acceptance.





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KrabLegs
2007-11-09 14:02:02 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Precision
Post by KrabLegs
You already know the answers to your questions. Now it is up to you to decide
what you want to do about it.
Your commentaries are always insightful.
As to your very last comment to my questions, it is interesting you ask just
now. I just finished watching 'V For Vendetta', I happened to catch its
eye-opening ending again while channel-surfing and couldn't resist seeing it
again. Rent this movie something, and you may understand my pragmatic
sentiments on this matter. The true irony is the ending is symbolic of what
the governing body always seemed to feel is the necessary solution to the
woes of 'this system of things' brought about by its power-hungry political
leaders.
Perhaps I don't have the strength let alone the chutzpah to participate in
the closure or 'reformation' of the administrative nightmare plaguing the
organization, but I sense someone who has nothing to loose very well might
be planning to do so. In any case, V's ending is the kind of closure worthy
of any situation where a few humans have absolute authority over so many.
The role of the head of Scotland Yard in the film especially riveted me.
There are those in Bethel who would likely view a long overdue change of the
so-called 'slave class' with similar stoic acceptance.
You've made me curious enough to seek out the movie to watch it. I am
interested in knowing what solution you think might be probable.

I can tell you personally that since I've left the organization, I am at peace
with myself and I feel a true closeness with God without the almost constant
intursive guilty feelings that I had when I was a JW. I guess I felt guilty
because I never could quite live up to the rules and regulations imposed by the
GB. Now that I'm free from man's rules, I have no problem living my life in
harmony with God's love, guidance, and direction.

I am now starting some research into the deception of the GB with their
insistence that 1914 CE was predicted in the 19th century as being the second
coming (parousia) of Jesus Christ. I have already found several references in
the Watchtower which makes the claim that the JW's have known long before 1914
that that would be the the year Jesus would return to rule over God's invisible
organization. However the REAL truth is that the JWs didn't get 'new light'
about their current beliefs regarding 1914 until 1925! Before then it was
believed that 1874 was the return of Jesus' invisible rule (parousia).

As I stated before, 1914 is the most significant part of the JW belief. That is
one of the first things that the newly interested ones are taught, and it is
repeated constantly in the magazines - constant reinforcement that ONLY the GB
has revealed that most significant date - THE date that was revealed to them and
only them by God's holy spirit.

A JW did some research on the 607 BCE date and wrote a letter to the GB. The GB
basically ignored his letter and suggested that he was spiritually sick. As you
know the 1914 date can't be correct if the 607 date is not correct. This is his
letter:

http://www.607v587.com/websitepage4.htm
~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
2007-11-09 21:10:22 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by KrabLegs
Post by Precision
Post by KrabLegs
You already know the answers to your questions. Now it is up to you to decide
what you want to do about it.
Your commentaries are always insightful.
As to your very last comment to my questions, it is interesting you ask just
now. I just finished watching 'V For Vendetta', I happened to catch its
eye-opening ending again while channel-surfing and couldn't resist seeing it
again. Rent this movie something, and you may understand my pragmatic
sentiments on this matter. The true irony is the ending is symbolic of what
the governing body always seemed to feel is the necessary solution to the
woes of 'this system of things' brought about by its power-hungry political
leaders.
Perhaps I don't have the strength let alone the chutzpah to participate in
the closure or 'reformation' of the administrative nightmare plaguing the
organization, but I sense someone who has nothing to loose very well might
be planning to do so. In any case, V's ending is the kind of closure worthy
of any situation where a few humans have absolute authority over so many.
The role of the head of Scotland Yard in the film especially riveted me.
There are those in Bethel who would likely view a long overdue change of the
so-called 'slave class' with similar stoic acceptance.
You've made me curious enough to seek out the movie to watch it. I am
interested in knowing what solution you think might be probable.
I can tell you personally that since I've left the organization, I am at peace
with myself and I feel a true closeness with God without the almost constant
intursive guilty feelings that I had when I was a JW. I guess I felt guilty
because I never could quite live up to the rules and regulations imposed by the
GB. Now that I'm free from man's rules, I have no problem living my life in
harmony with God's love, guidance, and direction.
I am now starting some research into the deception of the GB with their
insistence that 1914 CE was predicted in the 19th century as being the second
coming (parousia) of Jesus Christ. I have already found several references in
the Watchtower which makes the claim that the JW's have known long before 1914
that that would be the the year Jesus would return to rule over God's invisible
organization. However the REAL truth is that the JWs didn't get 'new light'
about their current beliefs regarding 1914 until 1925! Before then it was
believed that 1874 was the return of Jesus' invisible rule (parousia).
As I stated before, 1914 is the most significant part of the JW belief. That is
one of the first things that the newly interested ones are taught, and it is
repeated constantly in the magazines - constant reinforcement that ONLY the GB
has revealed that most significant date - THE date that was revealed to them and
only them by God's holy spirit.
A JW did some research on the 607 BCE date and wrote a letter to the GB. The GB
basically ignored his letter and suggested that he was spiritually sick. As you
know the 1914 date can't be correct if the 607 date is not correct. This is his
http://www.607v587.com/websitepage4.htm
Precision still, no matter what, believes that it's Gods chosen organization.
That is what holds them captured, it's pathological. There's no alternative,
even if you do everything right and find peace with God as you did after
leaving, they still believe that God will leave you alone to a violent death
in Armageddon. God only protects the people of his Chosen Organization,
you see, because they have the 'necessary solution to this system of things'.
God is agreeing with them, not you. Movies shows this, because Presicion
can see the bigger picture of the GB, and you can't. By leaving the Org you
disagree with God Jehovah's plan. That means you're against it, you're against
the New World Order, and there's no room for you on this planet because of
this. To JW's it's better that you were never born, than leaving the JW org.
That's because you will be dead and they wish for it to happen as quickly as
possible, so that Gods Plan of the New World can start. Presicion is still
in, but you're out. She sees the same faults but loves the org, so she will
be fine while you will DIE in Armageddon. Precision wants to change the
org, but still loves it, because she's loyal to God and you are disloyal and
will be birdfeed.

Saba
~ Säblë ~
2007-11-09 22:22:11 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
Precision still, no matter what, believes that it's Gods chosen organization.
And yet there is no evidence give anyone for that claim. The JWs totally
ignore the question when asked for evidence. From what I have heard and
read, the present GB made that up themselves and no one DARE ask them for
proof or evidence.
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
That is what holds them captured, it's pathological. There's no alternative,
even if you do everything right and find peace with God as you did after
leaving, they still believe that God will leave you alone to a violent death
in Armageddon.
See their past magazines for their gut churning bloody illustrations of
Armageddon - the JWs grinning like fools while children and puppies fall
down smoking craters. Is it any wonder so many JWs become mentally ill or
their children have nightmares and are bed-wetters?

God only protects the people of his Chosen Organization,
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
you see, because they have the 'necessary solution to this system of things'.
God is agreeing with them, not you. Movies shows this, because Presicion
can see the bigger picture of the GB, and you can't. By leaving the Org you
disagree with God Jehovah's plan.
Or so the WT's wicked false prophets want you to believe.......

That means you're against it, you're against
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
the New World Order, and there's no room for you on this planet because of
this. To JW's it's better that you were never born, than leaving the JW org.
That's because you will be dead and they wish for it to happen as quickly as
possible, so that Gods Plan of the New World can start. Presicion is still
in, but you're out. She sees the same faults but loves the org,
What choice does he/she have but to stay in the Org. If he leaves he loses
all his false JW friends and maybe even his tricked and beguiled family.

so she will
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
be fine while you will DIE in Armageddon. Precision wants to change the
org, but still loves it, because she's loyal to God and you are disloyal and
will be birdfeed.
See gruesome bloody illustrations in past WT magazines for how they envision
this horror.
--
SA.........
Yep, the false prophets at the WTS added another 120 years to 1914. What a
hoot! :-D The poor misled JWs who were waiting for 1975 got the shaft,
then 2000, shafted again... now this. What happened to all their promised
and underlined scripture proving the generation who saw 1914 would not pass
away before "the end of this system of things?" And they claim a clear
direct line to Jehovah!!!
How can any rational person be so gullible as to swallow this obvious male
bovine excreta? This GB vomit....
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Precision
2007-11-10 06:56:13 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by KrabLegs
Post by Precision
Post by KrabLegs
You already know the answers to your questions. Now it is up to you to decide
what you want to do about it.
Your commentaries are always insightful.
As to your very last comment to my questions, it is interesting you ask just
now. I just finished watching 'V For Vendetta', I happened to catch its
eye-opening ending again while channel-surfing and couldn't resist seeing it
again. Rent this movie something, and you may understand my pragmatic
sentiments on this matter. The true irony is the ending is symbolic of what
the governing body always seemed to feel is the necessary solution to the
woes of 'this system of things' brought about by its power-hungry political
leaders.
Perhaps I don't have the strength let alone the chutzpah to participate in
the closure or 'reformation' of the administrative nightmare plaguing the
organization, but I sense someone who has nothing to loose very well might
be planning to do so. In any case, V's ending is the kind of closure worthy
of any situation where a few humans have absolute authority over so many.
The role of the head of Scotland Yard in the film especially riveted me.
There are those in Bethel who would likely view a long overdue change of the
so-called 'slave class' with similar stoic acceptance.
You've made me curious enough to seek out the movie to watch it. I am
interested in knowing what solution you think might be probable.
Remember as you watch this movie that I view its final solution as symbolic
and not literal. I don't advocate anyone taking such drastic measures
literally. I don't advocate the governing body members meeting the fate of
the Chancellor, or Bethel meeting the fate of the Chancellor's headquarters.
If you can view the movie in a symbolic and not literal manner as to the
'solution' then I think you will understand where I'm coming from.

My only concern is somebody will view the movie, take it literally, and get
a proverbial wild hair up their bum. That would be a tragic attack on
freedom of religion in the most free national on the planet.

As I've said before with another analogy, one must RENOVATE, not destroy, if
true positive reform is to occur. Destroying something is the last resort of
the feeble minded who lack vision and true dedication to fulfilling the will
of God.

On that caveat, I'll be interested to hear your review of the movie and
opinion on whether it is indeed analogous to what's going on in the
organization... and the powerful symbolism in its stunning and unexpected
yet logical ending. I'm sure that I'll get an ear full from the loyal ones
who support the partyline if they too decide to go rent it! ;-)

I have a feeling you'll love Natalie Portman's role as Evy. Some might call
her the ultimate reformist who transforms from blissfully sleeping citizen
to eyes wide open in a manner which I'm sure we can all relate, even those
of us who are still sleeping.
Post by KrabLegs
I can tell you personally that since I've left the organization, I am at peace
with myself and I feel a true closeness with God without the almost constant
intursive guilty feelings that I had when I was a JW. I guess I felt guilty
because I never could quite live up to the rules and regulations imposed by the
GB. Now that I'm free from man's rules, I have no problem living my life in
harmony with God's love, guidance, and direction.
I am now starting some research into the deception of the GB with their
insistence that 1914 CE was predicted in the 19th century as being the second
coming (parousia) of Jesus Christ. I have already found several references in
the Watchtower which makes the claim that the JW's have known long before 1914
that that would be the the year Jesus would return to rule over God's invisible
organization. However the REAL truth is that the JWs didn't get 'new light'
about their current beliefs regarding 1914 until 1925! Before then it was
believed that 1874 was the return of Jesus' invisible rule (parousia).
As I stated before, 1914 is the most significant part of the JW belief.
That is
one of the first things that the newly interested ones are taught, and it is
repeated constantly in the magazines - constant reinforcement that ONLY the GB
has revealed that most significant date - THE date that was revealed to them and
only them by God's holy spirit.
A JW did some research on the 607 BCE date and wrote a letter to the GB.
The GB
basically ignored his letter and suggested that he was spiritually sick.
As you
know the 1914 date can't be correct if the 607 date is not correct. This is his
http://www.607v587.com/websitepage4.htm
Very interesting material, from someone not afraid to think or do mental
aerobics to get once stagnant blood circulating.






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~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
2007-11-10 16:59:56 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by KrabLegs
Post by Precision
Post by KrabLegs
You already know the answers to your questions. Now it is up to you to decide
what you want to do about it.
Your commentaries are always insightful.
As to your very last comment to my questions, it is interesting you ask just
now. I just finished watching 'V For Vendetta', I happened to catch its
eye-opening ending again while channel-surfing and couldn't resist seeing it
again. Rent this movie something, and you may understand my pragmatic
sentiments on this matter. The true irony is the ending is symbolic of what
the governing body always seemed to feel is the necessary solution to the
woes of 'this system of things' brought about by its power-hungry political
leaders.
Perhaps I don't have the strength let alone the chutzpah to participate in
the closure or 'reformation' of the administrative nightmare plaguing the
organization, but I sense someone who has nothing to loose very well might
be planning to do so. In any case, V's ending is the kind of closure worthy
of any situation where a few humans have absolute authority over so many.
The role of the head of Scotland Yard in the film especially riveted me.
There are those in Bethel who would likely view a long overdue change of the
so-called 'slave class' with similar stoic acceptance.
You've made me curious enough to seek out the movie to watch it. I am
interested in knowing what solution you think might be probable.
Remember as you watch this movie that I view its final solution as symbolic and not literal. I
don't advocate anyone taking such drastic measures literally. I don't advocate the governing body
members meeting the fate of the Chancellor, or Bethel meeting the fate of the Chancellor's
headquarters. If you can view the movie in a symbolic and not literal manner as to the 'solution'
then I think you will understand where I'm coming from.
My only concern is somebody will view the movie, take it literally, and get a proverbial wild hair
up their bum. That would be a tragic attack on freedom of religion in the most free national on
the planet.
As I've said before with another analogy, one must RENOVATE, not destroy, if true positive reform
is to occur. Destroying something is the last resort of the feeble minded who lack vision and true
dedication to fulfilling the will of God.
On that caveat, I'll be interested to hear your review of the movie and opinion on whether it is
indeed analogous to what's going on in the organization... and the powerful symbolism in its
stunning and unexpected yet logical ending. I'm sure that I'll get an ear full from the loyal ones
who support the partyline if they too decide to go rent it! ;-)
I have a feeling you'll love Natalie Portman's role as Evy. Some might call her the ultimate
reformist who transforms from blissfully sleeping citizen to eyes wide open in a manner which I'm
sure we can all relate, even those of us who are still sleeping.
Post by KrabLegs
I can tell you personally that since I've left the organization, I am at peace
with myself and I feel a true closeness with God without the almost constant
intursive guilty feelings that I had when I was a JW. I guess I felt guilty
because I never could quite live up to the rules and regulations imposed by the
GB. Now that I'm free from man's rules, I have no problem living my life in
harmony with God's love, guidance, and direction.
I am now starting some research into the deception of the GB with their
insistence that 1914 CE was predicted in the 19th century as being the second
coming (parousia) of Jesus Christ. I have already found several references in
the Watchtower which makes the claim that the JW's have known long before 1914
that that would be the the year Jesus would return to rule over God's invisible
organization. However the REAL truth is that the JWs didn't get 'new light'
about their current beliefs regarding 1914 until 1925! Before then it was
believed that 1874 was the return of Jesus' invisible rule (parousia).
As I stated before, 1914 is the most significant part of the JW belief. That is
one of the first things that the newly interested ones are taught, and it is
repeated constantly in the magazines - constant reinforcement that ONLY the GB
has revealed that most significant date - THE date that was revealed to them and
only them by God's holy spirit.
A JW did some research on the 607 BCE date and wrote a letter to the GB. The GB
basically ignored his letter and suggested that he was spiritually sick. As you
know the 1914 date can't be correct if the 607 date is not correct. This is his
http://www.607v587.com/websitepage4.htm
Very interesting material, from someone not afraid to think or do mental aerobics to get once
stagnant blood circulating.
Ok, my reply belong here:

If you think it's just mental gymnastics and fun to question this Org,
I guess that you forget that this monstrous org and it's top men directly causes
thousands of families to split, people to commit suicide, oustracizing their friends
as spiritually dead, killing people for a crazy & wild blood policy. And all for a
book & tract company gone off the bends, full of proud goated thinking that only
they have it made. Fun for you, realistic for those it destroys. But be a chummy
Jehovah witness for a Satanic,unchristian org of useless and inhumane doctrines.
See if you and your funny glees will benefit you when the judgement day
is coming up. Could it be you supported Satan all along? You have enough proof that
it's not of God. But maybe JWs like Satan, I don't know. They sure as hell become like
goats, like their proud father. It can be spotted on their shocking, uncompassionate,
false acts, mentality of hate - fruits. And their funny glees and mental jumps for fun.

Saba
~ Säblë ~
2007-11-07 19:41:54 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Precision
The circuit overseer emphasized something very important regarding the
respect we should have toward the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses.
Why should anyone show respect for those who did so much damage to so many
people and families with their lies and deceit?

The
Post by Precision
governing body are more than advisors. There is something far greater
going on in Brooklyn and Patterson, something on an epic and historical
scale!
Yes, the death rate of JWs due to believing these fakes who wrongly
predicted the end of this system over and over again.
Post by Precision
Those who criticize the governing body simply do not fully appreciate the
full scope and grandeur of God's WIFE and OUR MOTHER.
Oh now they're claiming their Jehovah's WIFE and your MOTHER? What next,
that they're GOD him/herself?

He cited the following
Post by Precision
article from the October 1, 1950 issue of the Watchtower magazine...
*** w50 10/1 pp. 347-348 The Way of Success ***
Huge propaganda BS ship.
--
SA.........
Religious societies are *less* moral than secular ones:
http://moses.creighton.edu/JRS/2005/2005-11.html
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Joe Smith
2007-11-07 19:47:20 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
From: ***@usenet.com (Precision)
Is Jehovah's 'wife' the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society?
#---------> Absolutely not. j.s

"The circuit overseer emphasized"
#--------------> The sales manager said, be loyal to our product. Sell
only for us wts. Why because god says so. Only we represent god. j.s
#----------->
"Hence keep in touch with the central organization, God's Theocratic
"woman".
#-----------> Then gods married to a gold digger and bitch. j.s
------------
"Why would ANYONE care about what anyone thinks, or whether they even
get expelled from an organization, if that religious organization is not
giving complete strangers in desperate POVERTY something to eat or
drink, or receive them hospitably because they are not members of their
religious affiliation, or help those sick and in prison -- WHEN CHRIST
CLEARLY STATES HE IS THOSE IMPOVERISHED INDIVIDUALS IN SPIRIT?"
#----------> No one that thinks does care if there "expelled from an
organization". Unless all there family are trapped in it. j.s
----------
"No; as Jehovah's witnesses we represent something greater than these
minor visible organizations."
#--------> Ego boost to the sales people. j.s
------------
The Salvation Army helps the poor, with food, clothing, jobs, getting
sober or off drugs. Collects other peoples junk. Sells it to survive and
create jobs. Has programs for the homeless, feeds the homeless. AA goes
into prisons to help people, sober up and clean up. There life style.
San Francisco provides food money vouchers for motels. For homeless
especially in winter. So does the city where i live. They have built a
homeless shelter, and provide food, clothes, etc. If you were homeless
sleeping on the street. For what ever reason. Would you want go to some
place, organization. That gave you food and a warm place to sleep, or
read the watchtower? Who is doing gods will? The Salvation army, Cities
and charities, or jw's selling watchtowers? Who would jesus really be
pleased with? btw How did that talk make you feel precision? Proud to be
a jw, or disgusted? When one person claims to be gods only chanel. They
get locked up in the funny farm. When a group says it there a religion.
Is the group any less crazy? j.s

-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
~ Säblë ~
2007-11-07 21:02:57 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Joe Smith
The Salvation Army helps the poor, with food, clothing, jobs, getting
sober or off drugs. Collects other peoples junk. Sells it to survive and
create jobs. Has programs for the homeless, feeds the homeless. AA goes
into prisons to help people, sober up and clean up. There life style.
San Francisco provides food money vouchers for motels. For homeless
especially in winter. So does the city where i live. They have built a
homeless shelter, and provide food, clothes, etc. If you were homeless
sleeping on the street. For what ever reason. Would you want go to some
place, organization. That gave you food and a warm place to sleep, or
read the watchtower? Who is doing gods will? The Salvation army, Cities
and charities, or jw's selling watchtowers? Who would jesus really be
pleased with? btw How did that talk make you feel precision? Proud to be
a jw, or disgusted? When one person claims to be gods only chanel. They
get locked up in the funny farm. When a group says it there a religion.
Is the group any less crazy? j.s
And you too have replied with an excellent reply left untrimmed for brevity.
The WTS doesn't believe in any form of charity work whatsoever. Every dime
they take in is for their own benefit and most is spent on purchasing more
real estate somewhere on the globe. Not a penny goes to even hand out
sandwiches and hot tea to the homeless on freezing cold nights yet the GB
live in splendor at the opulent, extravagant Patterson Complex in NY. I can
only hope the selfish, self-interested egomaniacs known as the GB pay for
what they're doing on the next world.
--
SA..........
http://silentlambs.org
http://www.cultwatch.com/jw.html
www.freeminds.org
http://dbhome.dk/carlo/ secret Elder's Manual
"Properly read, the Bible is the most potent
force for atheism ever conceived."
-= Isaac Asimov =-
~~~~ }<((((o> ~~~~ }<{{{{{Ò> ~~~~ }<((({ö> ~~~~
~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
2007-11-07 23:09:03 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Joe Smith
Is Jehovah's 'wife' the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society?
#---------> Absolutely not. j.s
"The circuit overseer emphasized"
#--------------> The sales manager said, be loyal to our product. Sell
only for us wts. Why because god says so. Only we represent god. j.s
#----------->
"Hence keep in touch with the central organization, God's Theocratic
"woman".
#-----------> Then gods married to a gold digger and bitch. j.s
------------
"Why would ANYONE care about what anyone thinks, or whether they even
get expelled from an organization, if that religious organization is not
giving complete strangers in desperate POVERTY something to eat or
drink, or receive them hospitably because they are not members of their
religious affiliation, or help those sick and in prison -- WHEN CHRIST
CLEARLY STATES HE IS THOSE IMPOVERISHED INDIVIDUALS IN SPIRIT?"
#----------> No one that thinks does care if there "expelled from an
organization". Unless all there family are trapped in it. j.s
----------
"No; as Jehovah's witnesses we represent something greater than these
minor visible organizations."
#--------> Ego boost to the sales people. j.s
------------
The Salvation Army helps the poor, with food, clothing, jobs, getting
sober or off drugs. Collects other peoples junk. Sells it to survive and
create jobs. Has programs for the homeless, feeds the homeless. AA goes
into prisons to help people, sober up and clean up. There life style.
San Francisco provides food money vouchers for motels. For homeless
especially in winter. So does the city where i live. They have built a
homeless shelter, and provide food, clothes, etc. If you were homeless
sleeping on the street. For what ever reason. Would you want go to some
place, organization. That gave you food and a warm place to sleep, or
read the watchtower? Who is doing gods will? The Salvation army, Cities
and charities, or jw's selling watchtowers? Who would jesus really be
pleased with? btw How did that talk make you feel precision? Proud to be
a jw, or disgusted? When one person claims to be gods only chanel. They
get locked up in the funny farm. When a group says it there a religion.
Is the group any less crazy? j.s
Great thoughts,Js.

Saba
Post by Joe Smith
-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
Precision
2007-11-10 06:59:39 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Joe Smith
Is Jehovah's 'wife' the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society?
#---------> Absolutely not. j.s
"The circuit overseer emphasized"
#--------------> The sales manager said, be loyal to our product. Sell
only for us wts. Why because god says so. Only we represent god. j.s
#----------->
"Hence keep in touch with the central organization, God's Theocratic
"woman".
#-----------> Then gods married to a gold digger and bitch. j.s
------------
"Why would ANYONE care about what anyone thinks, or whether they even
get expelled from an organization, if that religious organization is not
giving complete strangers in desperate POVERTY something to eat or
drink, or receive them hospitably because they are not members of their
religious affiliation, or help those sick and in prison -- WHEN CHRIST
CLEARLY STATES HE IS THOSE IMPOVERISHED INDIVIDUALS IN SPIRIT?"
#----------> No one that thinks does care if there "expelled from an
organization". Unless all there family are trapped in it. j.s
----------
"No; as Jehovah's witnesses we represent something greater than these
minor visible organizations."
#--------> Ego boost to the sales people. j.s
------------
The Salvation Army helps the poor, with food, clothing, jobs, getting
sober or off drugs. Collects other peoples junk. Sells it to survive and
create jobs. Has programs for the homeless, feeds the homeless. AA goes
into prisons to help people, sober up and clean up. There life style.
San Francisco provides food money vouchers for motels. For homeless
especially in winter. So does the city where i live. They have built a
homeless shelter, and provide food, clothes, etc. If you were homeless
sleeping on the street. For what ever reason. Would you want go to some
place, organization. That gave you food and a warm place to sleep, or
read the watchtower? Who is doing gods will? The Salvation army, Cities
and charities, or jw's selling watchtowers? Who would jesus really be
pleased with? btw How did that talk make you feel precision? Proud to be
a jw, or disgusted? When one person claims to be gods only chanel. They
get locked up in the funny farm. When a group says it there a religion.
Is the group any less crazy? j.s
-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from those
who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.





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~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
2007-11-10 16:56:08 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Joe Smith
Is Jehovah's 'wife' the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society?
#---------> Absolutely not. j.s
"The circuit overseer emphasized"
#--------------> The sales manager said, be loyal to our product. Sell
only for us wts. Why because god says so. Only we represent god. j.s
#----------->
"Hence keep in touch with the central organization, God's Theocratic
"woman".
#-----------> Then gods married to a gold digger and bitch. j.s
------------
"Why would ANYONE care about what anyone thinks, or whether they even
get expelled from an organization, if that religious organization is not
giving complete strangers in desperate POVERTY something to eat or
drink, or receive them hospitably because they are not members of their
religious affiliation, or help those sick and in prison -- WHEN CHRIST
CLEARLY STATES HE IS THOSE IMPOVERISHED INDIVIDUALS IN SPIRIT?"
#----------> No one that thinks does care if there "expelled from an
organization". Unless all there family are trapped in it. j.s
----------
"No; as Jehovah's witnesses we represent something greater than these
minor visible organizations."
#--------> Ego boost to the sales people. j.s
------------
The Salvation Army helps the poor, with food, clothing, jobs, getting
sober or off drugs. Collects other peoples junk. Sells it to survive and
create jobs. Has programs for the homeless, feeds the homeless. AA goes
into prisons to help people, sober up and clean up. There life style.
San Francisco provides food money vouchers for motels. For homeless
especially in winter. So does the city where i live. They have built a
homeless shelter, and provide food, clothes, etc. If you were homeless
sleeping on the street. For what ever reason. Would you want go to some
place, organization. That gave you food and a warm place to sleep, or
read the watchtower? Who is doing gods will? The Salvation army, Cities
and charities, or jw's selling watchtowers? Who would jesus really be
pleased with? btw How did that talk make you feel precision? Proud to be
a jw, or disgusted? When one person claims to be gods only chanel. They
get locked up in the funny farm. When a group says it there a religion.
Is the group any less crazy? j.s
-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from those who selflessly give to
the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
If you think it's just mental gymnastics and fun to question this Org,
I guess that you forget that this monstrous org and it's top men directly causes
thousands of families to split, people to commit suicide, oustracizing their friends
as spiritually dead, killing people for a crazy & wild blood policy. And all for a
book & tract company gone off the bends, full of proud goated thinking that only
they have it made. Fun for you, realistic for those it destroys. But be a chummy
Jehovah witness for a Satanic,unchristian org of useless and inhumane doctrines.
See if you and your funny glees will benefit you when the judgement day
is coming up. Could it be you supported Satan all along? You have enough proof that
it's not of God. But maybe JWs like Satan, I don't know. They sure as hell become like
goats, like their proud father. It can be spotted on their shocking, uncompassionate,
false acts, mentality of hate - fruits. And their funny glees and mental jumps for fun.

Saba

Saba
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Ips-Switch
2007-11-10 23:50:39 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Precision
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from
those who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
2007-11-11 13:52:30 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from those who selflessly give
to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get stays in their coffers.
Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus admonished his followers.
Hehe, Jesus isn't really necessary for their plan of sitting next to God on his throne.
They go for the very throne, and Jesus is lucky to be there next to them.

Saba
Ips-Switch
2007-11-11 20:58:57 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
Post by Ips-Switch
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what
Jesus admonished his followers.
Hehe, Jesus isn't really necessary for their plan of sitting next to God on his throne.
They go for the very throne, and Jesus is lucky to be there next to them.
Saba
Yep! They have themselves ruling the earth after Armageddon now! LOL!!!!
Notice the lying hypocrite Precision doesn't reply why the GB feel exempt
from what Jesus admonished his followers to do.

--
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from
those who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ }<(((o>
~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
2007-11-11 21:56:36 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get stays in their coffers.
Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus admonished his followers.
Hehe, Jesus isn't really necessary for their plan of sitting next to God on his throne.
They go for the very throne, and Jesus is lucky to be there next to them.
Saba
Yep! They have themselves ruling the earth after Armageddon now! LOL!!!! Notice the lying
hypocrite Precision doesn't reply why the GB feel exempt from what Jesus admonished his followers
to do.
One won't get an answer to that. The normal christian things like giving etc,
things coming from the heart bypasses JW's automatically as it's not a christian
group of follower. They follow their violent master, the father of the lies, twising
their minds, if they weren't twisted to begin with.

Saba
--
Post by ~s.a.b.a g.r.a.c.i.l.e~
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from those who selflessly give
to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ }<(((o>
KrabLegs
2007-11-11 19:05:25 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
In article <473643c4$0$1342$***@reader.greatnowhere.com>, Ips-Switch
says...
Post by Ips-Switch
Post by Precision
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from
those who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
I was discussing this with my girlfriend and she made a point that is so obvious
that we all missed it. Her questions were that if the WTBTS truly believe that
the system of things are going to come to an end any second now, why are they
amassing billions of dollars that will become useless when this system ends?
Why aren't they using the money to help the poor and the sick ones? Is that not
what Jesus would want us to do?
Ips-Switch
2007-11-11 21:03:17 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by KrabLegs
says...
Post by Ips-Switch
Post by Precision
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from
those who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
I was discussing this with my girlfriend and she made a point that is so obvious
that we all missed it. Her questions were that if the WTBTS truly believe that
the system of things are going to come to an end any second now, why are they
amassing billions of dollars that will become useless when this system ends?
Why aren't they using the money to help the poor and the sick ones? Is that not
what Jesus would want us to do?
There you go! Try asking a JW that question and watch their eyes glaze over
as Precision's has. And notice that Mark Sornson ran away again. When the
TRUTH gets too close to home he runs........ He knows he can't BS you so he
took off again. Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at dancing around
issues. One day he sees the TRUTH, the next day he's again kissing the GB's
@$$. I don't know if the WTS cult does this to people or if most people who
join this cult already have "issues."
KrabLegs
2007-11-11 21:49:23 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
In article <47376e07$0$1348$***@reader.greatnowhere.com>, Ips-Switch
says...
Post by Ips-Switch
Post by KrabLegs
says...
Post by Ips-Switch
Post by Precision
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from
those who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
I was discussing this with my girlfriend and she made a point that is so obvious
that we all missed it. Her questions were that if the WTBTS truly believe that
the system of things are going to come to an end any second now, why are they
amassing billions of dollars that will become useless when this system ends?
Why aren't they using the money to help the poor and the sick ones? Is that not
what Jesus would want us to do?
There you go! Try asking a JW that question and watch their eyes glaze over
as Precision's has. And notice that Mark Sornson ran away again. When the
TRUTH gets too close to home he runs........ He knows he can't BS you so he
took off again. Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at dancing around
issues. One day he sees the TRUTH, the next day he's again kissing the GB's
@$$. I don't know if the WTS cult does this to people or if most people who
join this cult already have "issues."
Mark Sornson won't be back anytime soon. He called me a coward but he has a
yellow streak running from back of his neck to his ass.

Don't be too hard on Precision. It's difficult for some JWs to break free. It
will come to him one day that the WTBTS can't be fixed. It can't be fixed
because it does not have God's blessing. It is a man-made organization using
God's name.

I used to be upset when people would call the JW organization a cult, but I had
to get out of it to recognize that. It has many of the cult characteristics. I
couldn't see that from the inside. It is like being in a trance. Pretty scary
actually...
Ips-Switch
2007-11-11 22:25:00 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by KrabLegs
says...
Post by Ips-Switch
Post by KrabLegs
says...
Post by Ips-Switch
Post by Precision
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from
those who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
I was discussing this with my girlfriend and she made a point that is so obvious
that we all missed it. Her questions were that if the WTBTS truly
believe
that
the system of things are going to come to an end any second now, why are they
amassing billions of dollars that will become useless when this system ends?
Why aren't they using the money to help the poor and the sick ones? Is that not
what Jesus would want us to do?
There you go! Try asking a JW that question and watch their eyes glaze over
as Precision's has. And notice that Mark Sornson ran away again. When the
TRUTH gets too close to home he runs........ He knows he can't BS you so he
took off again. Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at dancing around
issues. One day he sees the TRUTH, the next day he's again kissing the GB's
@$$. I don't know if the WTS cult does this to people or if most people who
join this cult already have "issues."
Mark Sornson won't be back anytime soon. He called me a coward but he has a
yellow streak running from back of his neck to his ass.
Don't be too hard on Precision. It's difficult for some JWs to break free. It
will come to him one day that the WTBTS can't be fixed. It can't be fixed
because it does not have God's blessing. It is a man-made organization using
God's name.
I used to be upset when people would call the JW organization a cult, but I had
to get out of it to recognize that. It has many of the cult
characteristics. I
couldn't see that from the inside. It is like being in a trance. Pretty scary
actually...
You described it as it is. The WTS uses mind and thought control as do all
cults. It uses reinforcement by requiring they read all the magazines
pumped out endlessly covering the same things over and over and over. All
those meetings are also a form of cult reinforcement as is the isolation
from normal society. It also uses empty promises (living forever) and fear
(DFing and shunning). I started to see these things within a year of being
snared. Several of us were suspicious so started to put our heads together
and ask questions. It was a rude awakening................
Joe Smith
2007-11-11 21:54:05 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
From: ***@spamnot.com (Ips-Switch)
"KrabLegs" <***@newsguy.com> wrote in message news:***@drn.newsguy.com...
In article <473643c4$0$1342$***@reader.greatnowhere.com>,
Ips-Switch says...
"Precision" <***@usenet.com> wrote in message news:***@sp6iad.superfeed.net...
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from
those who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what
Jesus
admonished his followers.
I was discussing this with my girlfriend and she made a point that is so
obvious
that we all missed it. Her questions were that if the WTBTS truly
believe that
the system of things are going to come to an end any second now, why are
they
amassing billions of dollars that will become useless when this system
ends?
Why aren't they using the money to help the poor and the sick ones? Is
that not
what Jesus would want us to do?
There you go! Try asking a JW that question and watch their eyes glaze
over as Precision's has. And notice that Mark Sornson ran away again.
When the TRUTH gets too close to home he runs........ He knows he can't
BS you so he took off again. Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at
dancing around issues. One day he sees the TRUTH, the next day he's
again kissing the GB's @$$. I don't know if the WTS cult does this to
people or if most people who join this cult already have "issues."
#-------------->
Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at dancing around issues
-------------------
This is what all jw's are taught to do. Especially when first seeing the
truth about the truth. This will happen. It takes time. It took me many
years of confusion, in the mind. Cognitive dissonance. In another thread
Precision said the end of the movie Vendetta showed why he didn't leave.
In my case there was a wife and kids involved. The wts trap. It was a
very difficult decision i made to leave. I knew it meant i would have no
say in my kids life. Also all my family on both sides were jw. I had
been raised jw, i knew nothing else. Some people for what ever reason
just can't leave. The price is to high. j.s

-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
Ips-Switch
2007-11-11 22:33:44 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Joe Smith
Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at dancing around issues
-------------------
This is what all jw's are taught to do. Especially when first seeing the
truth about the truth. This will happen. It takes time. It took me many
years of confusion, in the mind. Cognitive dissonance. In another thread
Precision said the end of the movie Vendetta showed why he didn't leave.
In my case there was a wife and kids involved. The wts trap.
Yes, it is indeed a trap. I knew more than a few JWs over the years who
wished desperately to leave but feared the consequences. This is how the
WTS keeps so many members entrapped, snared like rabbits, fearful and
uncertain and in constant stress. It manipulates them into uncompensated
laborers for the duration of their useful lives, then dumps them like bags
of trash when they become feeble or disabled. Remember the cruel treatment
the GB gave those who grew old and feeble at Bethel? They were forced out
and some were found living in the parks in Brooklyn. It was a real scandal
at the time. Meanwhile the GB lived in fine fashion up at Bethel with no
chance of having done to them what they did to others. That scandal made the
GB change it's policy to protect it's own @$$ and reputation by no longer
allowing people to work there all their lives thinking they're doing god's
work and that it'll get them into paradise.

It was a
Post by Joe Smith
very difficult decision i made to leave. I knew it meant i would have no
say in my kids life. Also all my family on both sides were jw. I had
been raised jw, i knew nothing else. Some people for what ever reason
just can't leave. The price is to high. j.s
Indeed it can be.........
Post by Joe Smith
-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
Precision
2007-11-11 23:55:45 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Joe Smith
Ips-Switch says...
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from
those who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what
Jesus
admonished his followers.
I was discussing this with my girlfriend and she made a point that is so obvious
that we all missed it. Her questions were that if the WTBTS truly
believe that
the system of things are going to come to an end any second now, why are they
amassing billions of dollars that will become useless when this system ends?
Why aren't they using the money to help the poor and the sick ones? Is that not
what Jesus would want us to do?
There you go! Try asking a JW that question and watch their eyes glaze
over as Precision's has. And notice that Mark Sornson ran away again.
When the TRUTH gets too close to home he runs........ He knows he can't
BS you so he took off again. Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at
dancing around issues. One day he sees the TRUTH, the next day he's
people or if most people who join this cult already have "issues."
#-------------->
Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at dancing around issues
-------------------
This is what all jw's are taught to do. Especially when first seeing the
truth about the truth. This will happen. It takes time. It took me many
years of confusion, in the mind. Cognitive dissonance. In another thread
Precision said the end of the movie Vendetta showed why he didn't leave.
In my case there was a wife and kids involved. The wts trap. It was a
very difficult decision i made to leave. I knew it meant i would have no
say in my kids life. Also all my family on both sides were jw. I had
been raised jw, i knew nothing else. Some people for what ever reason
just can't leave. The price is to high. j.s
-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
You obviously haven't (a) carefully read my posts, and (b) seen the movie "V
For Vendetta" that I recommended as a good movie rental.

Otherwise, or you and a few others wouldn't be so critical. Those lurkers
who have done (a) and (b) likely roll their eyes every time they read your
posts criticizing me. If you ever do decide to catch-up with my posts and
rent that movie, you're going to feel silly.






Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
----------------------------------------------------------
** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
----------------------------------------------------------
http://www.usenet.com
Joe Smith
2007-11-12 03:59:56 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Sun, Nov 11, 2007, 3:55pm From: ***@usenet.com (Precision)
"Joe Smith" <***@webtv.net> wrote in message news:24942-473779FD-***@storefull-3155.bay.webtv.net...
From: ***@spamnot.com (Ips-Switch)
"KrabLegs" <***@newsguy.com> wrote in message news:***@drn.newsguy.com...
In article <473643c4$0$1342$***@reader.greatnowhere.com>,
Ips-Switch says...
"Precision" <***@usenet.com> wrote in message news:***@sp6iad.superfeed.net... Good points about the
salvation army. We can all learn something from those who selflessly
give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers. And yet the WTS
avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get stays in their
coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
I was discussing this with my girlfriend and she made a point that is so
obvious
that we all missed it. Her questions were that if the WTBTS truly
believe that
the system of things are going to come to an end any second now, why are
they
amassing billions of dollars that will become useless when this system
ends?
Why aren't they using the money to help the poor and the sick ones? Is
that not
what Jesus would want us to do?
There you go! Try asking a JW that question and watch their eyes glaze
over as Precision's has. And notice that Mark Sornson ran away again.
When the TRUTH gets too close to home he runs........ He knows he can't
BS you so he took off again. Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at
dancing around issues. One day he sees the TRUTH, the next day he's
again kissing the GB's @$$. I don't know if the WTS cult does this to
people or if most people who join this cult already have "issues."
#-------------->
Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at dancing around issues
-------------------
This is what all jw's are taught to do. Especially when first seeing the
truth about the truth. This will happen. It takes time. It took me many
years of confusion, in the mind. Cognitive dissonance. In another thread
Precision said the end of the movie Vendetta showed why he didn't leave.
In my case there was a wife and kids involved. The wts trap. It was a
very difficult decision i made to leave. I knew it meant i would have no
say in my kids life. Also all my family on both sides were jw. I had
been raised jw, i knew nothing else. Some people for what ever reason
just can't leave. The price is to high. j.s
----------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
You obviously haven't (a) carefully read my posts, and (b) seen the
movie "V For Vendetta" that I recommended as a good movie rental.
Otherwise, or you and a few others wouldn't be so critical. Those
lurkers who have done (a) and (b) likely roll their eyes every time they
read your posts criticizing me. If you ever do decide to catch-up with
my posts and rent that movie, you're going to feel silly.
=A0=A0Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
#----------------->
First off i was not criticizing you. Is it easy to leave? Is seeing
things contrary to the party line. Easy to deal with? j.s
----
krab legs said"You already know the answers to your questions. Now it is
up to you to decide what you want to do about it."
----
Precision said"As to your very last comment to my questions, it is
interesting you ask just now. I just finished watching 'V For Vendetta',
I happened to catch its eye-opening ending again while channel-surfing
and couldn't resist seeing it again. Rent this movie something, and you
may understand my pragmatic sentiments on this matter. The true irony is
the ending is symbolic of what the governing body always seemed to feel
is the necessary solution to the woes of 'this system of things' brought
about by its power-hungry political leaders.
Perhaps I don't have the strength let alone the chutzpah to participate
in the closure or 'reformation' of the administrative nightmare plaguing
the organization, but I sense someone who has nothing to loose very well
might be planning to do so. In any case, V's ending is the kind of
closure worthy of any situation where a few humans have absolute
authority over so many. The role of the head of Scotland Yard in the
film especially riveted me. There are those in Bethel who would likely
view a long overdue change of the so-called 'slave class' with similar
stoic acceptance."
#--------------->
I just saw the movie. Based on comic books. A typical revenge movie.
Some symbolic meanings. The awakening of evy. The cop who allowed it to
happen."There are those in Bethel who would likely view a long overdue
change of the so-called 'slave class' with similar stoic acceptance."
Ultimately thats all any of us have stoic acceptance. Of live, death,
world governments etc. Things out of our own personal control. Or become
a terrorist ourselves. As to ideas we can choose. Fight them with words.
Like on this group. To fight ideas with violent actions. I now believe
to be wrong. Most people do. It is all inside. To continue to support an
idea with acceptance, attendance, money. Is to be a partner in the
crime, false idea.
I hate to admit this but i was not always this sane. I once loaded a
shot gun to go to the kingdom hall. I fantasized doing a similar thing
like V did. I am very glad sanity prevailed. Vengeance is mine and all
that. Plus i am not really like that. It is just at the time it all went
down. I was more than extremely angry. Enraged more like it.
The thing with dictators, theocracies people get fed up. People rebel
some use guns, political coup etc. If the wts. continues on its present
course. Those things could happen. Lots of mentally unstable people in
this world. One guy set fire to a kingdom hall in Oklahoma. I think. Jw
men have killed there families. One in oregon i think who ran and got
caught. imo True justice will demand the destruction of the wts. There
ideas have hurt to many people. The numbers seem to show soon there will
be as many non jw's as there are members. Like the chancellor hiding in
his tower. The gb thinks its protected. Look how many school shootings
in last 10 years or so. Kids who were teased. How much more pain does a
person go thru being df for say apostasy, especially those raised jw?
I think the gb should be worried. Lawyers, laws do not protect from
people. Who think they have nothing left to loose. Vengeance movies are
a fictional escape, watch it. Don't have to act it out, for most people.
"There are those in Bethel who would likely view a long overdue change
of the so-called 'slave class' with similar stoic acceptance." Are you
one of those?
"Perhaps I don't have the strength let alone the chutzpah to participate
in the closure or 'reformation' of the administrative nightmare plaguing
the organization" I really don't blame you. It is difficult, even if
only in ones mind. Am i criticizing you? Or are you criticizing
yourself? I would like to hear. What the end of that movie meant to you.
In your words. Even after watching the movie. I can really only guess.
"V's ending is the kind of closure worthy of any situation where a few
humans have absolute authority over so many." Is it?
J.s

-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
Precision
2007-11-12 05:58:26 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
I don't want to spoil the ending of the movie, Joe. For anyone who reads my
posts at a later date may decide to rent "V For Vendetta." Many don't
appreciate spoilers.

And besides, the ending is self-explanatory, I think. Except that I say
again the movie and its shocking conclusion is symbolic of the drastic legal
measures needed for positive change in ANY organized religion when those at
the highest pinnacles of power bear rotten fruit. Unless there are lawyers
who are baptized and willing to make positive changes (and assuming they
don't make matters worse after taking over the day to day responsibilities
of the governing body) then matters will likely continue to get worse before
things get better.


"Joe Smith" <***@webtv.net> wrote in message news:13743-4737CFBC-***@storefull-3158.bay.webtv.net...

Sun, Nov 11, 2007, 3:55pm From: ***@usenet.com (Precision)
"Joe Smith" <***@webtv.net> wrote in message news:24942-473779FD-***@storefull-3155.bay.webtv.net...
From: ***@spamnot.com (Ips-Switch)
"KrabLegs" <***@newsguy.com> wrote in message news:***@drn.newsguy.com...
In article <473643c4$0$1342$***@reader.greatnowhere.com>,
Ips-Switch says...
"Precision" <***@usenet.com> wrote in message news:***@sp6iad.superfeed.net... Good points about the
salvation army. We can all learn something from those who selflessly
give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers. And yet the WTS
avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get stays in their
coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
I was discussing this with my girlfriend and she made a point that is so
obvious
that we all missed it. Her questions were that if the WTBTS truly
believe that
the system of things are going to come to an end any second now, why are
they
amassing billions of dollars that will become useless when this system
ends?
Why aren't they using the money to help the poor and the sick ones? Is
that not
what Jesus would want us to do?
There you go! Try asking a JW that question and watch their eyes glaze
over as Precision's has. And notice that Mark Sornson ran away again.
When the TRUTH gets too close to home he runs........ He knows he can't
BS you so he took off again. Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at
dancing around issues. One day he sees the TRUTH, the next day he's
again kissing the GB's @$$. I don't know if the WTS cult does this to
people or if most people who join this cult already have "issues."
#-------------->
Precision is a flip-flopper and a pro at dancing around issues
-------------------
This is what all jw's are taught to do. Especially when first seeing the
truth about the truth. This will happen. It takes time. It took me many
years of confusion, in the mind. Cognitive dissonance. In another thread
Precision said the end of the movie Vendetta showed why he didn't leave.
In my case there was a wife and kids involved. The wts trap. It was a
very difficult decision i made to leave. I knew it meant i would have no
say in my kids life. Also all my family on both sides were jw. I had
been raised jw, i knew nothing else. Some people for what ever reason
just can't leave. The price is to high. j.s
----------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
You obviously haven't (a) carefully read my posts, and (b) seen the
movie "V For Vendetta" that I recommended as a good movie rental.
Otherwise, or you and a few others wouldn't be so critical. Those
lurkers who have done (a) and (b) likely roll their eyes every time they
read your posts criticizing me. If you ever do decide to catch-up with
my posts and rent that movie, you're going to feel silly.
Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
#----------------->
First off i was not criticizing you. Is it easy to leave? Is seeing
things contrary to the party line. Easy to deal with? j.s
----
krab legs said"You already know the answers to your questions. Now it is
up to you to decide what you want to do about it."
----
Precision said"As to your very last comment to my questions, it is
interesting you ask just now. I just finished watching 'V For Vendetta',
I happened to catch its eye-opening ending again while channel-surfing
and couldn't resist seeing it again. Rent this movie something, and you
may understand my pragmatic sentiments on this matter. The true irony is
the ending is symbolic of what the governing body always seemed to feel
is the necessary solution to the woes of 'this system of things' brought
about by its power-hungry political leaders.
Perhaps I don't have the strength let alone the chutzpah to participate
in the closure or 'reformation' of the administrative nightmare plaguing
the organization, but I sense someone who has nothing to loose very well
might be planning to do so. In any case, V's ending is the kind of
closure worthy of any situation where a few humans have absolute
authority over so many. The role of the head of Scotland Yard in the
film especially riveted me. There are those in Bethel who would likely
view a long overdue change of the so-called 'slave class' with similar
stoic acceptance."
#--------------->
I just saw the movie. Based on comic books. A typical revenge movie.
Some symbolic meanings. The awakening of evy. The cop who allowed it to
happen."There are those in Bethel who would likely view a long overdue
change of the so-called 'slave class' with similar stoic acceptance."
Ultimately thats all any of us have stoic acceptance. Of live, death,
world governments etc. Things out of our own personal control. Or become
a terrorist ourselves. As to ideas we can choose. Fight them with words.
Like on this group. To fight ideas with violent actions. I now believe
to be wrong. Most people do. It is all inside. To continue to support an
idea with acceptance, attendance, money. Is to be a partner in the
crime, false idea.
I hate to admit this but i was not always this sane. I once loaded a
shot gun to go to the kingdom hall. I fantasized doing a similar thing
like V did. I am very glad sanity prevailed. Vengeance is mine and all
that. Plus i am not really like that. It is just at the time it all went
down. I was more than extremely angry. Enraged more like it.
The thing with dictators, theocracies people get fed up. People rebel
some use guns, political coup etc. If the wts. continues on its present
course. Those things could happen. Lots of mentally unstable people in
this world. One guy set fire to a kingdom hall in Oklahoma. I think. Jw
men have killed there families. One in oregon i think who ran and got
caught. imo True justice will demand the destruction of the wts. There
ideas have hurt to many people. The numbers seem to show soon there will
be as many non jw's as there are members. Like the chancellor hiding in
his tower. The gb thinks its protected. Look how many school shootings
in last 10 years or so. Kids who were teased. How much more pain does a
person go thru being df for say apostasy, especially those raised jw?
I think the gb should be worried. Lawyers, laws do not protect from
people. Who think they have nothing left to loose. Vengeance movies are
a fictional escape, watch it. Don't have to act it out, for most people.
"There are those in Bethel who would likely view a long overdue change
of the so-called 'slave class' with similar stoic acceptance." Are you
one of those?
"Perhaps I don't have the strength let alone the chutzpah to participate
in the closure or 'reformation' of the administrative nightmare plaguing
the organization" I really don't blame you. It is difficult, even if
only in ones mind. Am i criticizing you? Or are you criticizing
yourself? I would like to hear. What the end of that movie meant to you.
In your words. Even after watching the movie. I can really only guess.
"V's ending is the kind of closure worthy of any situation where a few
humans have absolute authority over so many." Is it?
J.s

-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.




Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
----------------------------------------------------------
** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
----------------------------------------------------------
http://www.usenet.com
Joe Smith
2007-11-12 19:35:17 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/146316/1.ashx
Damage Limitation
We know that these days information on just about everything is widely
available. One or two clicks, a Google Search and a hole is blown in the
Watchtower Society's Cover. I remember once, on the weekend i was
staying at my Dad's i was searching for the Watchtower Society website
when i found an 'apostate' site. Nearly=A0eight=A0years on, i come to
this Site. Maybe=A0the site i visited that day=A0planted a seed, i
remember my terror when i realised where i'd ended up, i worried that
somehow i'd be discovered for my sin and my mind was racing running over
the lies i'd been told - perhaps the apostates could somehow see me?
The Society uses various tactics to limit Damage to its already near
sunken Vessel, if something cannot be defended its taught its members to
smear individuals that pose a threat.
Atheist or Believers we are all Ex-Jehovah's Witnesses -=A0people like
us have seen through the clouds of smoke, the corruption and lies and
have seen something that we probably didn't want to believe was true and
all we've taken is punishment for it. We've been hurt emotionally and we
were left to pick-up the pieces.
So how do we get back at the Society in a constructive manner and 'free
peoples minds'?
I think simply being happy does work, i agree with that but i also
believe we need to be vocal. In the confused mind of each and every
Jehovah's Witness is a door and behind that door is the dawning
realization that the Society are wrong, that they are wrong. It takes
guts to admit it.
Realization=A0is a long and slow process that from the Pro-Witness
standpoint is like a virus eating away at us when actually its the death
of what was and the beginning of the real you, the person you are
supposed to be. Thank God we stuck that out because technically the
cleverly engineered lies from the Society are supposed to be fool proof.
We take a risk by being vocal about what we've discovered i admit, but
some of us have seen the benefits of taking that chance. For example an
old friend of mine who i am partially responsible for coming into the
'truth' has since left, he and i met properly again only yesterday and
its like he never went in the religion. The reasons he left were
different from mine so i am happy to know that the only problem he has
is the wasted time and he's doing his best to make up for that. His
family cannot accept he's happy now he's without the Organization as his
prop, afterall he is living with a woman who has children from a
previous marriage but honestly i've never seen someone so content with
his life.
IP: uHghTHchZAmk4DGh

Re: Damage Limitation 11-Nov-07 16:19
So how do we get back at the Society in a constructive manner and 'free
peoples minds'?
Very good post.....I think, as a whole, that ex-Witnesses all over the
world are doing a good job at exposing the Organization for what it
truly is.=A0=A0 We've had upteen discussions on here exposing their
faulty doctrines (most notably the blood issue and the pedophile issue)
and lurkers who are still in can start to read and think for
themselves.=A0
The media is always exposing some Witness who's died due to the blood
ban, and there doesn't seem to be any shortage of scumbag elders being
charged with statutory rape/molestation, which is then plastered all
over the internet as well as TV.
There are other good sites too: Randy Watters, the new 'Quotes' website
as well as a dozen others.=A0 Reading the information on these sites can
help prepare those who are either still in, or thinking of leaving, when
they're questioned as to their faith.=A0 We encourage each other, give
advice, opinions and suggestions to others who have maybe been cut off
from their family and friends at the Hall.=A0
In reality, the Society is doing a damn good job themselves at exposing
their faulty doctrines to the world.=A0 I think the best thing we can
all do, is to continue on doing what we're doing already.
IP: PkD0N4dv2Yzi6Erf

Re: Damage Limitation 11-Nov-07 18:22
It is true that we must be doing something right, otherwise this place
and many like it wouldn't exist, i think you made an excellent point
about how the Society is a rod for its own back, its own worst enemy and
the more it tries to undo this mess the worse it gets because of course
there is a trail.
IP: uHghTHchZAmk4DGh

Re: Damage Limitation 12-Nov-07 07:23
And the worst part is that they created the problem themselves.=A0
Instead of listening to criticism, they bash it.=A0 They tell us to
listen to criticism.=A0 And then when they do something blatantly
harmful, they cannot take the heat.=A0 They also try to hide their past
to keep from being embarrassed.
The only thing that could save them now is to publicly declare that they
had been intentionally spreading lies, and then making stupid bans to
keep people from finding out the truth.=A0 From there, they would need
to reconstruct the whole religion, this time keeping an ear out for
criticism so that the imperfect men taking the lead can be corrected
when they mess up.=A0 Ultimately, that would result in a stronger
organization.=A0 The few that are only trying to derail the whole quest
for truth, perhaps to usurp power, could be weeded out because their
arguments would be specious at best.
But, they are not humble enough to take that course.=A0 Instead, they
cut off the members from reading critical material, whether from
apostates or from the public in general.=A0 They build up a fear of the
Internet.=A0 They demonize it to the max, threatening with demon
possession and death.=A0 But, what happens when someone makes a typo
when intending to find the official site and instead lands on an
apostate site?=A0 They make such an error more serious than it actually
is, since if someone saw an apostate site and the religion actually was
the truth, it would do little or no harm.
IP: 1vMGWoTkoC3Z29tU

-------------------------------------------------
I'd rather have questions I cannot answer than answers I cannot
question.
Precision
2007-11-11 23:50:59 UTC
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Post by KrabLegs
says...
Post by Ips-Switch
Post by Precision
Good points about the salvation army. We can all learn something from
those who selflessly give to the poor as Jesus admonished his followers.
And yet the WTS avoids all forms of charity giving. Every dime they get
stays in their coffers. Why do the GB feel they are exempt from what Jesus
admonished his followers.
I was discussing this with my girlfriend and she made a point that is so obvious
that we all missed it. Her questions were that if the WTBTS truly believe that
the system of things are going to come to an end any second now, why are they
amassing billions of dollars that will become useless when this system ends?
Why aren't they using the money to help the poor and the sick ones? Is that not
what Jesus would want us to do?
I've asked myself that same question. Dollars are soon-to-be-worthless
credits if Armageddon is coming real soon.

In times past, Christians were criticized for divesting themselves of all
currency they deemed "worthless" due to their belief the end was coming soon
without warning.

If people are starving to death and these so-called worthless dollars will
buy them food -- so they will be lucid enough to at least hear the truth as
witnessed from the Bible -- then why would anyone professing Christianity
squirrel these dollars away in a banking institution, in one of the most
powerful nations on the planet? I mean, these dollars will soon be WORTHLESS
when they become defunct at Armageddon.

So why not put dollars about to become worthless to good use, in feeding
those who are too starved to pay attention to our witnessing the good news?


IF THEY HAD DONE THIS... then I believe the organization might have grown to
over 100 million strong baptized Christians. Jehovah's Witnesses might be
head-to-head with Catholicism in numbers, and just because they used some of
the billions in worldwide donations to help feed the poor and cloth the
needy.


Instead, the governing body orders billions in DONATIONS squirreled away in
banks. They off the hook because Jesus said to do just that, in Matthew
25:27: "Well, then, you ought to have deposited my silver monies with the
bankers, and on my arrival I would be receiving what is mine with interest."

Is that a correct interpretation? Did Jesus mean to literally HOARD the
talent with literal bankers, IGNORING THE POOR? That would have made a
mockery of this admonishment to help the poor and needy!

Such financial management is prudent for worldly executives, because if this
system of things is to go on in perpetuity, one should SAVE the currency for
the lean years ahead!

If you have a BILLION DOLLARS to invest -- not just one talent (or modern
dollar) as Jesus was referring to in Matthew 25:27 -- and these dollars are
about to become worthless at Armageddon, but you do not know the day or hour
so cannot be sure if the end is not 50 years away, then here is the logical
2-step course of action:

(Step 1) Suppose the governing body allocated $500 million to feeding the
poor so their starving bodies do not detract from hearing the Bible's
message that feed's the soul?

(Step 2) Suppose they allocated the other $500 million to prudent savings
and investing, JUST IN CASE ARMAGEDDON DOES NOT COME IN OUR LIFETIMES?

Instead, they are placing their bets only on Step 2 thereby investing the
full BILLION DOLLARS in the financial system, just like English "old wealth"
invests billions so that generation after generation can enjoy wealth
century after century. They're assuming the Watchtower will be around for as
long as mankind doesn't kill itself off through global warming or
mismanagement of Earth's resources. They're assuming the prudent course of
action is to invest ALL donations in various investments including massive
real estate holdings, municipal bonds and other conservative vehicles of
investment! Their financial strategy is for the LONG TERM, and we're talking
about investing so the organization will prosper for CENTURIES INTO THE
FUTURE.

True, they use their financial resources to feed their own, those who are
baptized, when disasters occur. They also get more leverage from helping
fellow JWs in need during these disasters, by also helping the locals in the
vicinity of Kingdom Halls, as a witness to them of Christian charity.

But do they really engage in true Christian charity by seeking out the poor
around the world, and using this opportunity to witness the good news of
Christ's kingdom to lift these impoverished souls AFTER their physical needs
are attended to?

Regrettably not.

Your girl friend is astute...

Interestingly, when a religious corporation chooses to pinch every penny and
squirrel away billions in CONSERVATIVE LONG-TERM INVESTMENTS -- without
allocating anything to poverty -- it's implying it does NOT believe the end
of this world will come any time soon, and it believes maximizing every dime
for its long-term prosperity is worth ignoring the needs of the poor and
needy.

We know this form of investing was what Jesus Christ referred to when he
spoke about the slave who buried the talents safely in the ground (where
talents were the currency of 'dollars' of Jesus' day).

(Matthew 25:14-30)

14 "For it is just as when a man, about to travel abroad, summoned slaves of
his and committed to them his belongings. 15 And to one he gave five
talents, to another two, to still another one, to each one according to his
own ability, and he went abroad. 16 Immediately the one that received the
five talents went his way and did business with them and gained five more.
17 In the same way the one that received the two gained two more. 18 But the
one that received just one went off, and dug in the ground and hid the
silver money of his master.

19 "After a long time the master of those slaves came and settled accounts
with them. 20 So the one that had received five talents came forward and
brought five additional talents, saying, 'Master, you committed five talents
to me; see, I gained five talents more.' 21 His master said to him, 'Well
done, good and faithful slave! You were faithful over a few things. I will
appoint you over many things. Enter into the joy of your master.' 22 Next
the one that had received the two talents came forward and said, 'Master,
you committed to me two talents; see, I gained two talents more.' 23 His
master said to him, 'Well done, good and faithful slave! You were faithful
over a few things. I will appoint you over many things. Enter into the joy
of your master.'

24 "Finally the one that had received the one talent came forward and said,
'Master, I knew you to be an exacting man, reaping where you did not sow and
gathering where you did not winnow. 25 So I grew afraid and went off and hid
your talent in the ground. Here you have what is yours.' 26 In reply his
master said to him, 'Wicked and sluggish slave, you knew, did you, that I
reaped where I did not sow and gathered where I did not winnow? 27 Well,
then, you ought to have deposited my silver monies with the bankers, and on
my arrival I would be receiving what is mine with interest.

28 "'Therefore TAKE away the talent from him and give it to him that has the
ten talents. 29 For to everyone that has, more will be given and he will
have abundance; but as for him that does not have, even what he has will be
taken away from him. 30 And throw the good-for-nothing slave out into the
darkness outside. There is where [his] weeping and the gnashing of [his]
teeth will be.'

(End of quote.)


Notice the slave that buried the talent may have gotten himself off the hook
with his Master, by depositing the silver monies "with the bankers" so that
on his arrival, he would at least get back those monies "with interest." We
also know these words are symbolic. The "bankers" are symbolic and not
literal banking institutions. The "interest" is also symbolic and not
literal interest paid on bank accounts or other investment vehicles.

(Matthew 6:19-21) 19 "Stop storing up for yourselves treasures upon the
earth, where moth and rust consume, and where thieves break in and steal. 20
Rather, store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor
rust consumes, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where
your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

Jesus' metaphor was meant to show that his approved slaves on Earth in his
day and in the future would use the "talents" or spiritual riches he gave
them to save Christ's greatest riches on Earth -- and those riches, of
course, are the SHEEP TO BE GATHERED. There is nothing of greater value than
a person for whom Christ died. The riches Christ gave his slaves on Earth
throughout the ages up until modern times are intended to multiply the
riches of PEOPLE SAVED.

At the very least, had the Watchtower Society, so reminiscent of the slave
that buried the one talent in the ground in the parable, instead given that
talent to the Red Cross, UNICEF or other legitimate charitable organizations
(analogous to the "bankers" in the parable) then these charitable
organizations could have at least given back "interest" in the form of
people empowered with the physical strength to learn about God's kingdom!

Obviously, the ideal for the Watchtower Society, was to be analogous to the
slaves who MULTIPLIED THE TALENTS... by using the infrastructure of the
organization worldwide to use Christ's "talents" or spiritual riches to feed
the impoverished on a massive scale. As a result, Christ's "talents" or
impoverished sheep needing to be gathered, would be "multiplied" in the
numbers of those becoming baptized Christians.

Tragically, they missed the boat, buried the symbolic "talent" in the
ground, and now have nothing but soon-to-be-worthless dollars -- NOT
MULTIPLIED NUMBERS OF BAPTIZED CHRISTIANS LOOKING FORWARD TO PROSPERITY AND
JOY IN GOD'S KINGDOM -- to offer the Master.

That is why the numbers of Jehovah's Witnesses are not passing the numbers
of Catholics, Mormons and others. Instead of 100 million baptized Witnesses,
there are barely 1/10th that number. And I believe the present governing
body is going to reap what they have sown. Christ doesn't measure their
success in literal dollars or an impressive balance sheet so rich, the
organization can thrive in perpetuity for centuries to come...

(Matthew 25:28-30)
28 "'Therefore TAKE away the talent from him and give it to him that has the
ten talents. 29 For to everyone that has, more will be given and he will
have abundance; but as for him that does not have, even what he has will be
taken away from him. 30 And throw the good-for-nothing slave out into the
darkness outside. There is where [his] weeping and the gnashing of [his]
teeth will be.'






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Post by Precision
The circuit overseer emphasized something very important regarding the
respect we should have toward the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses. The
governing body are more than advisors. There is something far greater going
on in Brooklyn and Patterson, something on an epic and historical scale!
Those who criticize the governing body simply do not fully appreciate the
full scope and grandeur of God's WIFE and OUR MOTHER. He cited the following
article from the October 1, 1950 issue of the Watchtower magazine...
*** w50 10/1 pp. 347-348 The Way of Success ***
VISIBLE REPRESENTATIVES LIKE HER
22 In this world it is customary to speak of a high school, college or
university from which a person graduates by the heathen expression "alma
mater" (fostering mother). But the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead is not
the great mother organization of the Gilead graduates. The Watch Tower Bible
& Tract Society is not the great mother organization of Jehovah's witnesses
who have received the Kingdom truth through it and who cooperate with it
world-wide, using it as their legal and business servant and advisory
governing body. No; as Jehovah's witnesses we represent something greater
than these minor visible organizations. The great "mother" is Jehovah's
universal organization, which he created and of which he is the faithful
Husband. (Isa. 54:5; Gal. 4:26) By her he brings forth his beloved children
for his purpose. By her he gives us law and instruction, provides for us,
guides us and looks out for our welfare with a view to our everlasting life.
In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous woman so lovelily
described to King Lemuel. Just now, when God's kingdom is the paramount
issue, his "woman" is chiefly concerned with bringing forth successfully to
kingship with Jesus Christ in heaven the remnant of his royal "little flock".
Yet she is interested also in the many, many "other sheep" who will
eventually become her earthly children in God's image and likeness. Her
heart is big enough to hold a love now for them all and to gather all these
"other sheep" to her warm, loving bosom.-Luke 12:32; John 10:16.
23 However, what we see exemplified in God's woman, his heavenly universal
organization, we should look to see in his visible organization. Why?
Because his higher, greater universal organization uses it as her earthly
instrument. That is why we do see those motherly traits, those traits and
acts of a virtuous woman, in the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and in
the Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, because these profess to represent
and serve God's woman. We thank God for providing and using them. So we
stand up respectfully and bless his faithful organization, his queenly
"woman" in heaven which makes all these loving provisions for us as children
of God.-Prov. 31:28.
24 If we have an appreciation of all these truths, what shall we say is the
way of success? All the examples and the teachings of the Word of God agree
that it is the way marked by faithful, loving obedience to God and to the
commandments he issues through his Theocratic organization. Hence keep in
touch with the central organization, God's Theocratic "woman". Keep in tune
with it by accepting the Theocratic organization rules and instructions
which God issues to us through it. Never forsake these, but be teachable, as
trustful children. Hold fast to the Bible.
(End of quotation.)
How many reading this newsgroup JWs agree or disagree?
Pay special attention to the first sentence of paragraph 23!
Notice the article is NOT claiming the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is
"God's woman" or wife.
Rather, the article is simply pointing out what was emphasized in the
preceding paragraph, that Jehovah's "universal organization" that is OVER
his "visible organization" is a "virtuous woman." (In the preceding
paragraph it states, "In her we find fulfilled all the traits of a virtuous
woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel.") Therefore, paragraph 23 simply
points out that if the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society is Jehovah's
"visible organization" that it must exemplify God's "heavenly universal
organization" it also refers to as God's spiritual "wife"!
Further, paragraph 23 also points out that the Watchtower Bible School of
Gilead and the Watchtower Society itself both "profess to represent and
serve God's woman." We are expected to "thank God for providing and using
them" (the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead and Watchtower Society) because
they claim (or "represent") to "profess and serve God's woman."
Why do we believe what they claim in this regard. We believe because as the
preceding paragraph points out, "in her we find fulfilled all the traits of
a virtuous woman so lovelily described to King Lemuel."
That may have been true in 1950.
Is it true today?
Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?
Do we thank God for providing and using them as the article says we surely
must do?
Does it ring true for us today that "her heart is big enough to hold a love
now for them all and to gather all these "other sheep" to her warm, loving
bosom"? (Luke 12:32; John 10:16.)
The governing body ARE the Watchtower Society.
They have signature authority. They control the Watchtower trust accounts
through major banking institutions. The very nature of the U.S. corporation
gives them authority over billions in real estate and assets.
Although they could have closed the Watchtower and legally retired as
billionaires due to the very nature of U.S. corporate laws for private
religious corporations, they selflessly chose to maintain and serve one of
the richest religious organizations next to the Mormon Church. To this very
day, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses have been exemplary and
honest business men, burying the proverbial "talents" safely in the soils of
the banking system, real estate and securities holdings and other
financially safe instruments. These assets are buried safely under the
powers of modern financial laws in the United States of America, the most
powerful modern "empire" in human history, a nation to pale Rome and Egypt
by comparison. The Watchtower Society's treasures on earth serve the Kingdom
Halls around the world.
Did the governing body ever profess to be perfect? I challenge anyone to
find a statement in the publications where the governing body claims
perfection!
Matthew 19:21
21 Jesus said to him: "If you want to be perfect, go sell your belongings
and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my
follower."
Alright, so the governing body took Jesus up on his offer to "come and by my
follower" but skipped the part where Jesus said to first "go sell your
belongings and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven."
After all, suppose the governing body's response was "what if we don't want
to have treasure in heaven?" and they decided to keep that treasure on
earth? That could explain why they skipped the part about giving to the
poor, and proceeding to the last part, the part where Jesus said "come and
be my follower"?
There is always an explanation for why people do things! Now, whether they
make right or wrong choices, THAT is for YOU to decide!
Today, is it still accurate to describe the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society
with the qualities of virtue and beauty? Are we in awe at their largesse
toward their fellow man to view them with such feelings of deep respect?
THE CIRCUIT OVERSEER GAVE THE FOLLOWING LITMUS TEST TO ASK OURSELVES IF WE
34 "Then the king will say to those on his right, 'Come, YOU who have been
blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for YOU from the founding
of the world. 35 For I became hungry and YOU gave me something to eat; I got
thirsty and YOU gave me something to drink. I was a stranger and YOU
received me hospitably; 36 naked, and YOU clothed me. I fell sick and YOU
looked after me. I was in prison and YOU came to me.' (Matthew 25:34-36)
- Do we give those who are hungry something to eat?
- Do we give those who are thirsty something to drink?
- Do we receive strangers hospitably?
- Do we help those who are naked, sick, or in prison?
I'm personally not aware that any of the billions in contributions are going
to the aforementioned four areas of concern I just questioned?
Are you aware?
I'm only concerned because it's important for me personally -- as I'm sure
it is important for YOU personally -- to belong to an organization that can
reasonably believe it will be sitting on Jesus Christ's right side (Matthew
25:34-36).
Otherwise, what's the point of spending a lot of time going door to door.
Jesus Christ didn't exempt those who go door to door.
Christ instead laid in on the line in Matthew 25:34-36 quoted above.
Christ further made no mention of the preaching the good news of the kingdom
throughout the entire inhabited earth, as a witness to all the nations, when
41 "Then he will say, in turn, to those on his left, 'Be on YOUR way from
me, YOU who have been cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the
Devil and his angels. 42 For I became hungry, but YOU gave me nothing to
eat, and I got thirsty, but YOU gave me nothing to drink. 43 I was a
stranger, but YOU did not receive me hospitably; naked, but YOU did not
clothe me; sick and in prison, but YOU did not look after me.' 44 Then they
also will answer with the words, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or
thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison and did not minister to
you?' 45 Then he will answer them with the words, 'Truly I say to YOU, To
the extent that YOU did not do it to one of these least ones, YOU did not do
it to me.' 46 And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the
righteous ones into everlasting life." (Matthew 25:41-46)
Why would ANYONE care about what anyone thinks, or whether they even get
expelled from an organization, if that religious organization is not giving
complete strangers in desperate POVERTY something to eat or drink, or
receive them hospitably because they are not members of their religious
affiliation, or help those sick and in prison -- WHEN CHRIST CLEARLY STATES
HE IS THOSE IMPOVERISHED INDIVIDUALS IN SPIRIT? By withholding helping the
poor is not a religious organization stabbing Jesus Christ in the back? I
guess so because that's exactly what Jesus Christ says in Matthew 25:41-46,
feeling so strongly against these organizations and individuals they risk
losing the gift of eternal life.
Obviously Christ takes CHARITY very seriously. So why would any religious
organization refuse to engage in charitable help toward the poor, in light
of what Jesus Christ said?
I'm especially puzzled when a religious organization with BILLIONS refuses
to spend one dime on helping the poor, ignoring Jesus Christ's wishes
expressed in Matthew 25:24-46, particularly when the organization's
GOVERNING BODY is so advanced in years they can't take these billions with
them?
Think about it... WHEN you are 97 years old, if you're blessed enough to
live that long, and you had access to BILLIONS that U.S. laws say you have
the legal authority to allocate to whatever cause you wish, would you
(a) help as many poor and impoverished people around the world as you can to
show Jesus Christ you take his words in Matthew 25:24-46 seriously, but
mainly because YOU LOVE YOUR FELLOW MAN? or
(b) bury the proverbial Master's "talents" (where the Master is symbolic for
Jesus Christ and the "talents" are billions in assets) safely in the ground
in the insured U.S. banking system which is the most powerful nation on
earth, doing nothing to help anyone who is impoverished (directing a
fraction of those assets to printing books at cost for loyal members of your
religious organization, doling out funds to rebuild Kingdom Hall facilities
owned by your religious corporation, and supporting two state-of-the-art
facilities in New York)?
If you said (a) then you obviously appreciate the importance to Jesus Christ
of charity and aiding the poor, as Jesus did his entire life.
If you said (b) then I can't resist asking, Are you a member of the current
GOVERNING BODY reading this newsgroup on a laptop over a wi-fi connection
from your comfortable quarters at Bethel?
If you said BOTH then you need to be one of the members of the GOVERNING
BODY!
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How sweet and wonderful it is to see such light as has been set before eyes that can see and ears that can hear
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